| 时间 | 英文 | 中文 |
|---|---|---|
| [00:14] | 堪萨斯州 帕克城 | |
| [02:08] | 心 理 神 探 | |
| [02:38] | He never said a word. | 他完全没说起过 |
| [02:43] | All kids have secrets. But this? | 所有的孩子都有秘密 但这秘密 |
| [02:48] | He tried to tell us, Bill. | 他试过告诉我们 比尔 |
| [02:51] | He kept saying, “I’m sorry. I’m sorry, Mommy.” | 他一直说”对不起 对不起 妈妈” |
| [02:54] | – I don’t remember that. – When he wet the bed. | -我不记得了 -在他尿床之后 |
| [02:57] | He hasn’t done that in years. | 他好几年没尿过床了 |
| [02:59] | Oh, God. I… I thought he was ashamed, but… | 天呐 我…我以为他是觉得自己丢人 但 |
| [03:04] | Was he trying to tell us, Bill? | 他是想告诉我们吗 比尔 |
| [03:06] | I don’t know, Nance. | 我不知道 南茜 |
| [03:08] | What did he think happened to that little boy? | 他认为那个小男孩遭遇了什么事 |
| [03:10] | They had to know he wasn’t breathing. | 他们肯定知道他已经没有呼吸了 |
| [03:12] | He wasn’t a part of any of… of that. He… | 他没有参与那些事 他… |
| [03:17] | – He watched. – He knew enough to put him on a cross. | -他只是旁观 -他都知道要把他放上十字架了 |
| [03:23] | He thought it would bring him back to life. | 他以为那会让他活过来 |
| [03:27] | I never liked that Martin boy. | 我从没喜欢过那个叫马丁的男孩子 |
| [03:29] | I told you, we should never have let him play with him. | 我说过了 我们不该让他和布莱恩一起玩 |
| [03:31] | He’s too rough. | 他太粗野了 |
| [03:33] | What if he’d done that to Brian instead? | 要是惨遭毒手的是布莱恩呢 |
| [03:35] | We both thought it was good seeing Bri finally have friends. | 你我一致认为小布终于有朋友是好事 |
| [03:40] | Are they gonna take him from us? | 他们会把他从我们身边带走吗 |
| [03:42] | I won’t let that happen. | 我不会让那样的情况发生 |
| [03:44] | He has a good home. | 他有个很好的家 |
| [03:58] | Hello? | 喂 |
| [04:02] | I’m dealing with a family matter. Can you tell him…? | 我正在处理家事 你能告诉他… |
| [04:08] | Okay. | 好吧 |
| [04:10] | Okay, I’ll be right in. | 行 我马上就到 |
| [04:15] | – Now? – Gunn wants to see me. | -现在去吗 -甘恩要见我 |
| [04:17] | I’ll tell him I’m taking the week off. | 我会跟他说我这周请假 |
| [04:19] | – A week? – Nance. | -就一周吗 -南茜 |
| [04:21] | I just meant we need to get a handle on things. | 我的意思就是我们得把事情处理好 |
| [04:24] | Find out what’s next. | 想想接下来该怎么做 |
| [04:44] | What happened? | 怎么回事 |
| [04:51] | I’m sorry, sir. | 抱歉 长官 |
| [04:52] | I know I should be in Atlanta. | 我知道我应该在亚特兰大的 |
| [04:54] | – I got a phone call… – Which is more than I got. | -我接到了一通电话… -都没跟我打个招呼 |
| [04:57] | Apologies. | 抱歉 |
| [04:59] | – I should have called. – At the very least. | -我应该先打电话说一声的 -这是最起码的 |
| [05:01] | The city has been begging for federal help for weeks, | 亚特兰大几周以来都在寻求联调局帮助 |
| [05:03] | and we are kicked out in less than 24 hours. | 而我们在不到24小时内就被赶出去了 |
| [05:05] | Yes, you should have called. | 是啊 你是该先打个电话 |
| [05:06] | I had to hear it from the Atlanta office this morning. | 我今早才从亚特兰大办公室那边得到消息 |
| [05:09] | Apparently, Holden’s introduction wasn’t well received | 很明显 安全专员并不接受 |
| [05:11] | by the safety commissioner? | 霍顿的提议 |
| [05:13] | – Have you spoken with Holden? – No. | -你跟霍顿通过话了吗 -没有 |
| [05:15] | I’m asking you, as the leader of your department, | 我在问你 你这部门领导怎么当的 |
| [05:17] | what did Holden say that so offended the city? | 霍顿到底说了什么让他们如此生气 |
| [05:19] | The commissioner’s excuse that this wasn’t really a kidnapping | 专员借口说这并不是绑架 |
| [05:22] | was a convenient means to an end. | 不过是借题发挥 |
| [05:24] | What did Holden say? | 霍顿到底说了什么 |
| [05:25] | Honestly, sir, nothing out of line. | 说实话 长官 他没说什么出格的话 |
| [05:27] | He gave the commissioner an overview: | 他给专员做了综述 |
| [05:29] | that we look for connections. | 说我们在寻找联系 |
| [05:31] | He did explain he felt there could be a single, black predator. | 他是有提出 他认为可能有一个黑人杀人狂 |
| [05:35] | It may have been more how he said it, sir, | 长官 比起他说的内容 |
| [05:36] | – than what he said. – How so? | -可能他说的方式才是问题所在 -怎么说 |
| [05:39] | He might have gone into | 他可能说得太具体了 |
| [05:39] | more specifics than we can support right now. | 很多细节我们现在并没有证据支持 |
| [05:42] | The impression from the Atlanta SAC | 亚特兰大安全顾问委员会的说法是 |
| [05:44] | is that Holden was trying to steer the investigation | 霍顿试图把调查导向 |
| [05:47] | into “Avenues the city doesn’t want to explore right now, | “市政府目前不想探索的方向 |
| [05:50] | at least not publicly.” | 至少不想公开探索” |
| [05:51] | Sounds like politics, frankly. | 说实话 听起来很像政客那套说辞 |
| [05:52] | Name me a major city where there are no politics. | 你倒是说说哪个大城市没有权术之争 |
| [05:55] | We have to be smarter than this. | 我们得放聪明点儿 |
| [05:57] | If you sense that Holden is wading into political waters, | 如果你察觉到霍顿�入政治这趟浑水了 |
| [05:59] | it’s your job to stop him… | 你就该制止他 这是你的职责 |
| [06:01] | or at least give me the opportunity to anticipate the fallout. | 或者至少告诉我一声 让我预想到后果 |
| [06:05] | Yes, sir. You’re right. | 是 长官 你说得没错 |
| [06:08] | I should’ve read the room better. | 我应该把当时的局势看得更清楚些 |
| [06:09] | We want them to understand why they need us, | 我们想让他们明白 他们为什么需要我们 |
| [06:12] | not why they should be wary of us. | 而不是为什么要提防我们 |
| [06:13] | I understand, sir. | 我明白 长官 |
| [06:15] | This cannot happen again, Bill. | 这种事不许再发生第二次 比尔 |
| [06:26] | You couldn’t have called me? | 你就不能先给我打个电话吗 |
| [06:27] | Bill, it all happened so fast. | 比尔 事情发生得太快 |
| [06:29] | Well, someone had enough time to call Gunn. | 那怎么有人有空打电话给甘恩 |
| [06:31] | Barney told me there was nothing we could have done. | 巴尼跟我说 我们再做什么也是无济于事 |
| [06:33] | It’s all politics. | 都是政治 |
| [06:34] | – I’m happy to talk to Ted. – No. You’re not talking to anyone. | -我很乐意跟泰德谈谈 -不 你不许跟任何人谈 |
| [06:37] | And it wasn’t all politics, Holden, | 霍顿 要不是你开始兜售你那些 |
| [06:38] | until you started selling your unsupported conclusions. | 还站不住脚的结论 政治因素也不会介入 |
| [06:42] | You agreed the perpetrator is likely black. | 你也同意凶手很可能是黑人 |
| [06:44] | Can you see, just for a moment, how it might be perceived | 你有没有哪怕一刻想过 你还没去犯罪现场 |
| [06:47] | when you present a profile | 就给出了你的侧写 |
| [06:49] | without ever having been to a crime scene? | 别人会怎样看待这件事 |
| [06:50] | Next time, shut up until we’ve done some groundwork! | 下一次 没到现场勘查之前不许开口 |
| [07:19] | Sorry you had to hear that. | 抱歉让你听到那些 |
| [07:22] | You look terrible. | 你看上去糟透了 |
| [07:24] | Thanks. | 多谢关心 |
| [07:26] | So, I take it the Atlanta trip has been… curtailed? | 所以 亚特兰大之旅提早结束了是吗 |
| [07:31] | I can point the finger at Holden, | 我可以指着鼻子骂霍顿 |
| [07:33] | but I’m supposed to be watching him. | 但我本该看着他的 |
| [07:35] | Supposed to be his blinders. | 我本该拦着他点儿 |
| [07:37] | I let him get swept up in the moment, impressing people, | 我放任他在当时出风头了 |
| [07:39] | then he must’ve stepped on a land mine. | 他一定是踩到地雷了 |
| [07:41] | It’s a full-time job. | 这是个全天候的工作 |
| [07:43] | Yeah. | 是啊 |
| [07:45] | Look, I’ll get better at it, | 我之后会花更多精力盯着他的 |
| [07:47] | but I need to take a little time today. | 但今天我暂时没空 |
| [07:49] | – Family thing. – Everything okay? | -家里有事要处理 -一切还好吗 |
| [07:51] | Yeah. You know, just… I’ll be back in tomorrow. | 没什么大事 我明天就回来上班 |
| [07:55] | Okay. | 好的 |
| [08:01] | Gregg and I did Henley. | 格雷格和我跟亨里谈话了 |
| [08:03] | Gregg? | 格雷格 |
| [08:04] | Yeah. We thought you guys would be gone for weeks, | 对 我们以为你们会离开好几周 |
| [08:06] | and we didn’t want the interviews to lag. | 不希望约谈进度滞后 |
| [08:08] | How’d he do? | 他表现如何 |
| [08:09] | A little… hesitant. | 有点…迟疑 |
| [08:12] | – He shit the rug, didn’t he? – It was a team effort. | -他搞砸了 是不是 -那是团队努力的结果 |
| [08:15] | The transcripts should be done by tomorrow. | 明天应该就能完成转录了 |
| [08:18] | Look forward to it. | 那我就拭目以待了 |
| [08:31] | We’re gonna be late. | 我们要迟到了 |
| [08:32] | We’ll be fine. | 不会的 |
| [08:33] | It starts in two minutes. | 只有两分钟就要开场了 |
| [08:35] | So we’ll miss the trailers. | 大不了不看预告片嘛 |
| [08:38] | By the time we get our drinks and our seats, | 等我们到时候买好饮料找到座位 |
| [08:39] | we’ll definitely miss something. | 肯定就会落下开头了 |
| [08:42] | This feels like a big deal. | 听你一说感觉还挺严重啊 |
| [08:44] | You’re passing it. | 你开过头了 |
| [08:45] | 《一笼傻鸟》 《富贵逼人来》 《铁皮鼓》 | |
| [08:46] | It’s fine. I’m gonna get this spot. | 没事 我是为了倒进停车位 |
| [08:49] | Look, it’s just that I’m one of those people | 我就是那种要把电影 |
| [08:51] | who needs to see the whole thing. | 从头到尾看完的人 |
| [08:53] | Like, I like to get my popcorn, my seat. | 我享受买爆米花 找座位 |
| [08:55] | I like to watch the trailers. | 还有看预告片的整个过程 |
| [08:58] | A lot of people feel this way. | 很多人都是这样的 |
| [09:00] | If you say so. | 你说是就是吧 |
| [09:04] | But it’s gonna take me at least another minute | 不过我至少还需要一分钟的时间 |
| [09:06] | to pull into this space. | 才能把车停好 |
| [09:09] | Because I am a really… | 因为我停车… |
| [09:12] | slow… parker. | 真的很慢 |
| [09:15] | We are definitely… | 我们肯定… |
| [09:18] | going to miss… something. | 会迟到了 |
| [09:27] | You know, I have an unopened, very mediocre, | 其实我公寓里有一瓶还未开封 味道平平 |
| [09:31] | probably spoiled, bottle of Chablis at my apartment. | 可能还变质了的白葡萄酒 |
| [09:36] | Really? | 真的吗 |
| [09:38] | It has a screw top. | 是螺旋塞的 |
| [09:41] | I mean, how can I say no to that? | 谁又能拒绝这种诱惑呢 |
| [10:06] | What? | 怎么了 |
| [10:08] | Nothing. | 没事 |
| [10:16] | Do you have that wine? | 你真有那瓶酒吗 |
| [10:19] | I thought for sure I had unsold you on that. | 我还以为你铁定不想喝了呢 |
| [10:55] | I didn’t picture you living in a place like this. | 我没想到你会住在这种地方 |
| [10:59] | Small? | 太小了吗 |
| [11:01] | Sparse. | 太零落 |
| [11:03] | Your life seems very abundant. | 你的生活似乎很充实 |
| [11:06] | Well, one’s expansiveness of spirit | 一个人内心的充裕 |
| [11:08] | needn’t be reflected by one’s personal surroundings. | 不需要周遭环境来反映 |
| [11:12] | Who said that? | 这话是谁说的 |
| [11:13] | Me, just now. Didn’t you recognize my voice? | 我刚说的 没听出来吗 |
| [11:20] | He’s adorable. | 他很可爱 |
| [11:22] | Yeah. He’s not bad. | 是啊 挺乖的小孩 |
| [11:26] | How often do you see him? | 你多久见他一次 |
| [11:28] | I’m seeing him this weekend. | 这周末就去见他 |
| [11:30] | Gonna take him to a Dukes game. | 带他去看公爵队的比赛 |
| [11:32] | Dukes? | 公爵队 |
| [11:33] | Double-A baseball. | 职业棒球小联盟 |
| [11:36] | You miss him? | 你想他吗 |
| [11:38] | Of course. | 当然了 |
| [11:41] | It’s just the idea of shaping another life that terrifies me. | 只是光想想要抚养另一个生命就让我恐惧 |
| [11:44] | I can barely manage my own. | 我连自己都照顾不过来 |
| [11:47] | I still got milk crates for shelves. | 我还拿牛奶箱当架子呢 |
| [11:49] | I’ve got real shelves, and I don’t think that shelves equate | 我家就装了真架子 不过这又不能说明 |
| [11:51] | to any higher understanding. | 谁更成熟 |
| [11:54] | What you’ve done takes courage. | 你所做的决定需要勇气 |
| [11:58] | I’m happy that you’re leading an authentic life. | 看到你过着真正的生活 我很高兴 |
| [12:02] | I’m happy to be here. | 我很高兴能来这里 |
| [12:04] | With you. | 和你一起 |
| [12:13] | Me too. | 我也是 |
| [12:28] | I like baseball. | 我喜欢看棒球 |
| [12:31] | You like baseball? | 你居然喜欢棒球 |
| [12:33] | I mean, I’m sure I would if I ever went to a game. | 我要是去现场看比赛的话 肯定就会爱上 |
| [12:41] | Wendy, I don’t introduce my son to people I’m dating. | 温迪 我不会把我的约会对象介绍给我儿子 |
| [12:47] | Oh, no. Of course. | 当然 没事 |
| [12:49] | It’s not… | 我不是… |
| [12:50] | No, it’s… it’s fine. | 没关系的 |
| [12:52] | I… I’m… I’m sorry. I shouldn’t have. | 抱歉 我不该提这件事 |
| [12:54] | – This is not about you. – No. | -这跟你没有关系 -我知道 |
| [12:56] | Not specifically you. It’s just… | 不是针对你 只是 |
| [12:57] | You… You shouldn’t introduce | 你确实不该把 |
| [12:58] | your son to people that you don’t know. | 连你都不甚了解的人介绍给孩子 |
| [13:00] | You know, I interview the by-products of promiscuous mothers, | 我与滥交母亲意外生下的孩子谈过话 |
| [13:03] | and it’s… | 结果… |
| [13:04] | I’m not saying that you’re… | 我没说你是那种… |
| [13:13] | Can we just go back to just a few minutes ago, | 我们能让时光倒流到几分钟前吗 |
| [13:15] | after I had the best sex of my life, | 就在我享受完最爽的性爱之后 |
| [13:17] | and before I invited myself to Little League? | 擅自提议要一起去看微联盟比赛之前 |
| [13:22] | It’s “Minor league.” | 是”小联盟” |
| [13:24] | And… he would really like you. | 他肯定会很喜欢你的 |
| [13:28] | He’s just… He’s been through a lot, and I don’t… | 只是他经历了很多 我不想… |
| [13:31] | I don’t want to freak him out. | 我不想吓着他 |
| [13:33] | You know, not until it’s… something. | 至少在我们确定关系之前不行 |
| [13:39] | Was that really the best sex of your life? | 那真是你最爽的性爱吗 |
| [13:47] | Nice save, the dyke mentor story. | 挺会救场 女同导师的故事 |
| [13:50] | And just in time. | 切入的时机也正好 |
| [13:52] | I had to come up with something | 我得编造出个故事 |
| [13:53] | that would make him feel accepted. | 让他觉得自己是被接纳的 |
| [13:55] | Well, it worked. | 奏效了 |
| [13:56] | But then he adamantly denied being homosexual. | 但他之后又矢口否认自己是同性恋 |
| [13:58] | He was actually more defensive about that | 比起被人叫做施虐狂 |
| [14:00] | than he was about being called a sadist. | 他其实对此更有戒备心 |
| [14:02] | Me thinks the lady doth protest too much. | 我觉得那女士太喜欢辩驳了 |
| [14:04] | He protests a lot of things. Rape, torture, murder. | 他申辩了很多事 强奸 折磨 谋杀 |
| [14:07] | By saying that he didn’t engage in those aspects of the crimes, | 借由说自己没有参与这些罪行 |
| [14:10] | he characterizes himself as a nonparticipant. | 他把自己描述成未参与者 |
| [14:13] | It’s amazing how he’s able to compartmentalize. | 他居然还能划分清楚 太厉害了 |
| [14:17] | We have to consider, Henley was a kid. | 但我们得考虑到亨里当时还是个小孩 |
| [14:20] | He might view his participation | 他可能会觉得自己的参与行为 |
| [14:21] | as having been beyond his control. | 是超出他可控范围的 |
| [14:23] | He knew exactly what was gonna happen to the victims he procured. | 他十分清楚他诱拐来的受害者会有何种下场 |
| [14:26] | And he made a conscious decision not to intervene. | 他也有意识地决定不去干涉 |
| [14:29] | So whether he participated or not, he’s culpable. | 所以不管他是否参与其中 他都有罪 |
| [14:31] | I think there’s a distinction between procurement, | 我觉得诱拐 虽然已经很糟了 |
| [14:34] | as fucked up as it is, and murder. | 和谋杀还是有区别的 |
| [14:36] | Distinction, yes, but not absolution. | 是有区别没错 但也不能免罪 |
| [14:38] | I’m not excusing him. I’m just asking, | 我不是在为他开脱 我只是想问 |
| [14:41] | can a teenager be held responsible for the actions of an adult? | 一个青少年应该为另一个成年人的行为负责吗 |
| [14:44] | He was trying to please Corll. | 他只是想讨好科尔 |
| [14:46] | He was probably afraid of him. | 他可能很害怕他 |
| [14:47] | Actually, he seemed to be more in thrall of Corll | 他其实更像是被科尔所吸引 |
| [14:50] | – than he was afraid of him. – So is that why he stuck around? | -而不是惧怕他 -这才是他留下的原因吗 |
| [14:52] | He got off on watching Corll kill? | 看科尔杀人会让他性奋 |
| [14:53] | How do we know Henley got off on it? | 我们怎么知道亨里享受其中 |
| [14:55] | “When I did something, whatever it was, I enjoyed it.” | “我做一件事时 不管是什么事 我都尽量享受其中” |
| [14:59] | Bill, he assisted in killing 20 boys. | 比尔 他协助杀了二十个男孩 |
| [15:01] | What could possibly be defensible in that? | 怎么可能有理由为之开脱 |
| [15:03] | All I’m saying is, he was 14. | 我只是说 他当时才14岁 |
| [15:06] | Can we really lump him in with Kemper and Brudos? | 我们真要把他和坎伯和布鲁多斯相提并论吗 |
| [15:09] | Without Corll’s influence, | 要不是科尔的影响 |
| [15:11] | would he have ever progressed to murder? | 他会走到谋杀那一步吗 |
| [15:12] | There’s no way to know. | 我们无从得知 |
| [15:14] | But incredibly, he acknowledges a deep connection | 但难以置信的是 虽然他曾目睹对方 |
| [15:16] | with a man that he saw do horrific things. | 做出可怕的事 他仍承认与那人有密切关系 |
| [15:19] | Who even threatened to kill him. | 那个人甚至威胁要杀掉他 |
| [15:20] | Maybe his need for acceptance | 也许他对接纳感的需要 |
| [15:21] | was more powerful than any moral boundary. | 比任何道德约束的作用都更强大 |
| [15:24] | And Corll exploited that. | 科尔利用了那一点 |
| [15:28] | I’ve been thinking that we should talk about our tactics. | 我在想 我们应该讨论一下策略 |
| [15:33] | You know, we wouldn’t have gotten any of this if I hadn’t… | 我们能得到这些成果 多亏了我… |
| [15:36] | – Improvised? – Maybe made some shit up? | -即兴发挥 -编了段胡话 |
| [15:38] | Touché. | 一语中的 |
| [15:40] | If we’re going to teach an interview technique, | 要是我们教别人面谈技巧 |
| [15:42] | it can’t be strictly following the instrument. | 不可能是完全照本宣科 |
| [15:44] | So far, the only thing that’s worked | 现在看来 唯一有用的方法就是 |
| [15:46] | is to talk about them. | 把他们作为谈话中心 |
| [15:51] | Sir. | 长官 |
| [15:56] | Henley? | 亨里 |
| [15:59] | Quite a maneuver, Dr. Carr. | 计策用得妙 卡尔博士 |
| [16:00] | I thought I was reading Holden. | 我还以为我读到的是霍顿 |
| [16:03] | Gregg, would you give us a minute, please? | 格雷格 让我们单独谈谈 好吗 |
| [16:14] | Assistant Director Wyman is coming down in a few weeks. | 副局长怀曼几周后要过来 |
| [16:18] | I’m having a small gathering at my home, | 我打算在家里小聚一下 |
| [16:20] | and I’d like you all to come. | 想请你们都来参加 |
| [16:21] | Of course. Be happy to, Ted. | 当然 很乐意去 泰德 |
| [16:23] | Wyman could be a powerful advocate in DC. | 怀曼是我们在华府的有力支持者 |
| [16:26] | I’d like him to hear our narrative directly from you, | 我想让他直接听你们讲 |
| [16:28] | the people who created this. | 是你们发明这种方法的 |
| [16:29] | Yes, sir. | 好的 长官 |
| [16:30] | So, it’s a working party. | 所以是一次工作聚会 |
| [16:32] | Yes, but I want you to have a good time, Bill. Bring Nancy. | 对 但你们要玩得开心 比尔 带上南茜 |
| [16:36] | Holden, Dr. Carr, please feel free to bring a guest. | 霍顿 卡尔博士 尽管带一位宾客来 |
| [16:41] | Thank you, sir. We’ll plan on it. | 谢谢 长官 我们会计划一下的 |
| [16:44] | One more thing. | 还有件事 |
| [16:47] | I got you Manson. | 我帮你们争取到曼森了 |
| [16:49] | – When? – Three weeks. | -什么时候 -三周后 |
| [16:58] | Holy shit. | 天啊 |
| [16:58] | We have to think carefully about how we approach this. | 我们得仔细想想从何下手 |
| [17:01] | Did he say Manson? | 他是说曼森吗 |
| [17:02] | We approach it like we do every interview. | 我们就像平时面谈一样 |
| [17:03] | No. This is the first time that we’ll sit down | 不 这是我们第一次面对 |
| [17:05] | with a subject who hasn’t actually taken a life. | 一个没真正杀过人的研究对象 |
| [17:08] | Now what would be valuable | 我们得从团队的角度 |
| [17:09] | would be to look at him from the team perspective. | 来看待他 |
| [17:12] | Manson was the undisputed leader of his Family. | 曼森是曼森家族毋庸置疑的领导 |
| [17:14] | Then that’s our approach. | 那么 那就是我们的切入点 |
| [17:17] | The ME’s report corroborates the testimony of the other children: | 法医报告证实了另一个孩子的证词 |
| [17:21] | that Brian did not directly engage in the activities | 布莱恩没有直接参与 |
| [17:24] | that led to the death of the victim. | 致使受害者死亡的行为活动 |
| [17:27] | However, he was present and, as he has admitted, | 然而 他在场 而且正如他所承认的 |
| [17:30] | he was the one who suggested placing the victim on the cross. | 是他提议将受害者摆在十字架上的 |
| [17:33] | He thought it would bring Daniel back to life… | 他觉得那样做 丹尼尔就可以死而复生 |
| [17:35] | Mrs. Tench, a child has been forever lost to his family. | 坦奇太太 一个家庭永远地失去了孩子 |
| [17:39] | Brian seemingly acted without malice, and because of his age, | 布莱恩似乎没有恶意 而且因为他还小 |
| [17:42] | I’m choosing not to pursue legal action against him. | 我选择不起诉他 |
| [17:45] | But the State cannot ignore | 但政府不会忽视 |
| [17:47] | that he had ample opportunity to go for help | 他本来有足够的机会去外面求助 |
| [17:50] | or to speak with you, his parents, after the fact. | 或者事发之后和他的父母 也就是你们说出此事 |
| [17:53] | He chose not to. | 这两样他都没选 |
| [17:54] | Either he was evading detection, | 要么他是想避免被发现 |
| [17:57] | or he has no concept of right and wrong. | 要么他就是对是非没有概念 |
| [17:59] | The State is obligated to try to understand his motives | 政府有义务理解他的动机 |
| [18:02] | to ensure he is not a danger to himself or the community. | 确保他不会对他自己或社区构成威胁 |
| [18:06] | – A danger? – I am transferring him | -威胁 -我要把他转到 |
| [18:08] | to the Department of Health and Human Services for evaluation. | 卫生及公共服务部做评估 |
| [18:11] | Will we be able to keep him at home? | 他可以跟我们住在家里吗 |
| [18:13] | Yes. | 可以 |
| [18:13] | You have been assigned a caseworker | 给你们分配了一名社工 |
| [18:15] | and a mental health professional. | 还有一位精神健康专家 |
| [18:17] | The court will render decisions based solely on their evaluations. | 法庭会仅依靠他们的评估做出决定 |
| [18:22] | Your compliance in this process is mandatory | 你们有义务在此期间陪伴他 |
| [18:25] | and will be critical in determining Brian’s future. | 这对决定布莱恩的未来非常关键 |
| [18:30] | Social workers are underpaid and overeducated. | 社工通常收入低学历高 |
| [18:32] | Don’t try and sit this person down | 别想跟这个人坐下好好聊 |
| [18:34] | and explain your way out of this. | 靠解释摆平此事 |
| [18:36] | It won’t go over well with them. | 这样对付他们效果并不好 |
| [18:38] | No matter what hoops they present, it’s best to jump through. | 不管他们问你多刁钻的问题 最好顺着他们来 |
| [18:41] | I thought once they found out Brian was telling the truth, | 我以为一旦他们发现我家布莱恩说的是实话 |
| [18:43] | this would be over. | 这件事就结了 |
| [18:44] | We get to keep him at home, Nance. | 我们得让他留在家 南茜 |
| [18:46] | To be poked and prodded by strangers. | 被陌生人戳戳点点 |
| [18:49] | – A social worker? – We don’t have a choice. | -还是个社工 -我们没得选 |
| [18:52] | He didn’t do anything. | 他什么都没做 |
| [18:56] | – Thanks, Art. I appreciate everything… – It’s all right, Bill. | -谢了 阿尔特 感谢你 -没事 比尔 |
| [18:58] | I’ve got kids myself. | 我自己也有孩子 |
| [19:00] | Take care. | 保重 |
| [19:08] | Why didn’t you say something in there? | 你刚才怎么什么都不说 |
| [19:11] | You won’t defend your own child? | 你不为自己家孩子辩护 |
| [19:12] | It’s not a courtroom, honey. | 那不是法庭 亲爱的 |
| [19:14] | Art’s right, we have to go through the process. | 阿尔特说得对 这个流程我们必须走 |
| [19:19] | And maybe it’s not a bad idea for Brian to talk to someone. | 也许让布莱恩跟别人谈谈并不是个坏主意 |
| [19:22] | He’s not defective. | 他不是低能儿 |
| [19:24] | He’s not a criminal. | 他不是罪犯 |
| [19:27] | I know that, Nance. | 我知道 南茜 |
| [19:29] | He’s coming home with us. | 他要跟我们一起回家了 |
| [19:31] | Today was a good day. | 今天很顺利 |
| [20:05] | Seriously? | 真的吗 |
| [20:06] | He’s not bad. | 他不坏 |
| [20:08] | Just tough to promote? | 就是很难提升 |
| [20:10] | You’re down the rabbit hole. | 你走火入魔了 |
| [20:13] | Did I miss anything that matters? | 我错过了什么重要的吗 |
| [20:15] | No. We were just about to start talking objectives. | 没有 我们正要开始讨论目标 |
| [20:18] | Wendy is absolutely right. | 温迪说得太对了 |
| [20:19] | We’re not asking Manson about killing. | 我们不问曼森杀人的事 |
| [20:22] | What we need to find out is how a diminutive, uneducated ex-con | 而是要弄清楚一个矮小 未受过教育的前罪犯 |
| [20:25] | convinced a group of middle-class teenagers | 是如何说服一群中产阶级青少年 |
| [20:28] | to brutally murder seven strangers. | 残忍杀害七个陌生人的 |
| [20:31] | The killers: | 凶手们 |
| [20:33] | Susan Atkins, 19. | 苏珊・阿特金斯 19岁 |
| [20:35] | Manson called her “Sadie.” | 曼森叫她”萨迪” |
| [20:37] | Church choir member. | 教堂唱诗班成员 |
| [20:38] | Linda Kasabian, 20. | 琳达・卡萨宾 20岁 |
| [20:40] | Good student. | 好学生 |
| [20:41] | Described as a “Starry-eyed romantic” by her friends. | 朋友说她是”乐观的浪漫主义者” |
| [20:45] | Patricia Krenwinkel, 22. | 帕特里夏・克伦温克尔 22岁 |
| [20:47] | Studied catechism. Considered becoming a nun. | 学习教理问答 本想成为修女 |
| [20:50] | Mary Brunner, 26. | 玛丽・布伦纳 26岁 |
| [20:53] | Librarian. | 图书管理员 |
| [20:55] | And Tex Watson, 24. | 还有泰克斯・沃森 24岁 |
| [20:58] | Honors student, school paper editor, lettered athlete. | 荣誉学生 校报编辑 成绩优异的运动员 |
| [21:01] | Looks like a high school yearbook. | 看起来像是高中年鉴 |
| [21:03] | All grew up in average homes, had high school educations, | 都在中产家庭长大 接受过高中教育 |
| [21:05] | some had college. | 有些还上过大学 |
| [21:07] | Then all became runaways | 结果都离家出走 |
| [21:08] | and somehow washed up in Manson’s Family. | 不知怎么最终流落到了曼森家族中 |
| [21:10] | With the exception of Brunner, the very first Family member, | 除了布伦纳 家族的第一个成员 |
| [21:13] | their transformation to murderers took less than two years. | 他们变成杀人犯只用了不到两年的时间 |
| [21:17] | Mary Brunner wasn’t involved in the Tate/LaBianca murders. | 玛丽・布伦纳并没有参与塔特及拉比安卡谋杀案 |
| [21:19] | That’s correct. She was arrested with Bobby Beausoleil | 没错 就在塔特及拉比安卡谋杀案发生前两天 |
| [21:23] | just two days before Tate/LaBianca. | 她和博比・博索莱伊一起被逮捕了 |
| [21:26] | The pair killed a music producer over a bad drug deal, | 两人因毒品交易冲突杀死了一名音乐制作人 |
| [21:29] | but what’s really of interest is the scene. | 但真正有意思的是犯罪现场 |
| [21:32] | Brunner and Beausoleil tried to pin | 布伦纳和博索莱伊想把罪案 |
| [21:33] | their murder on the Black Panthers | 嫁祸给黑豹党 |
| [21:35] | by writing “Political piggy” on the wall in the victim’s blood. | 于是用受害人的血在墙上写了”政治白皮猪” |
| [21:43] | Now here’s the LaBianca scene. | 而这张是拉比安卡受害现场 |
| [21:45] | “Death to pigs.” | “白皮猪去死” |
| [21:47] | And the scene at Cielo Drive… | 还有房子大门上 |
| [21:50] | “Pig” In Sharon Tate’s blood. | 用莎朗・塔特的血写的”白皮猪” |
| [21:53] | Helter Skelter. | “末日混乱” |
| [21:53] | “末日混乱”出自披头士乐队1968年发行的《白色专辑》中的同名歌曲 曼森家族声称是该专辑传递的信息怂恿他们杀人 | |
| [21:55] | It was Manson’s theme. | 这就是曼森的主题 |
| [21:57] | The prosecution’s case | 检方最后认定 |
| [21:58] | rested on his desire to incite a race war as motive | 曼森的动机是煽动种族战争 |
| [22:01] | and his control over the Family as means. | 通过控制曼森家族来达到这一目的 |
| [22:03] | Ever heard of Krishna Venta? | 听说过克里希纳・文塔吗 |
| [22:05] | – No. – Ex-con who declared himself a messiah. | -没有 -一个自称为救世主的前科犯 |
| [22:08] | He founded his own church, | 他创办了自己的教会 |
| [22:09] | preaching society was corrupt and doomed. | 宣称这个社会已经腐烂崩坏 |
| [22:13] | He said there was a race war coming. | 他说马上会有一场种族战争 |
| [22:15] | Krishna said he knew a secret place in the desert | 克里希纳说自己知道沙漠里某个秘密的地方 |
| [22:18] | where he and his flock could wait it all out. | 他和追随者可以在那里等尘埃落定 |
| [22:20] | Then, when the war was over, | 然后 等战争结束 |
| [22:22] | 二人制造爆炸案 死亡人数上升至十人 | |
| [22:22] | they’d emerge and create a new civilization. | 他们将重现创建新的文明 |
| [22:24] | That’s right out of Manson’s playbook. | 这是从曼森的剧本里学的 |
| [22:26] | Krishna’s playbook. | 是克里希纳的剧本 |
| [22:29] | Manson stayed at his church in ’68. | 1968年曼森曾加入他的教会 |
| [22:31] | He said, “It’s like the spirit of everything brought me there.” | 他说”就像万物之灵引领我去那里” |
| [22:34] | Later, he espoused exactly the same doctrine, | 之后 他宣讲着一模一样的教义 |
| [22:37] | calling it “Helter Skelter.” | 称之为”末日混乱” |
| [22:38] | Helter Skelter wasn’t even Manson’s idea? | 末日混乱甚至不是曼森原创的吗 |
| [22:41] | As borrowed as the name. | 跟名字一样都是借来的 |
| [22:42] | He’s a fraud. | 他是个骗子 |
| [22:43] | Still, the question remains, | 但问题还没解决 |
| [22:45] | how does a guy like that… | 这样的人是怎么 |
| [22:48] | get kids like that… | 让这样的孩子们 |
| [22:51] | to do that? | 做出这种事 |
| [23:04] | Have you noticed any changes in his behavior, self-soothing? | 有注意到他行为上的改变吗 比如自慰 |
| [23:08] | Not at all. | 没有 |
| [23:27] | Do you read to him, Mrs. Tench? | 你会读书给他听吗 坦奇太太 |
| [23:30] | He likes Clifford the Big Red Dog. | 他喜欢听《大红狗克里弗》 |
| [23:35] | Sports, Mr. Tench? | 运动呢 坦奇先生 |
| [23:37] | He rides his bike. | 他会骑自行车 |
| [23:39] | – Almost off training wheels. – But no team sports. | -快能摆脱辅助轮了 -但没参与团队运动 |
| [23:42] | No. | 没有 |
| [23:57] | What does he do when he’s upset? | 他难过时会怎么做 |
| [24:00] | He’s not a big talker, but… | 他不怎么喜欢讲话 但是 |
| [24:01] | he always comes to us if he needs anything. | 如果他需要什么总会来找我们 |
| [24:12] | And he attends the public school? | 他上的是公立学校 |
| [24:14] | Yes. | 是的 |
| [24:16] | Which has no special education department? | 没有特殊教育部门 |
| [24:19] | – No. – No, we’ve never felt | -没有 -没有 我们从没觉得 |
| [24:20] | he needed that kind of… | 他需要那种… |
| [24:22] | Brian’s just shy. | 布莱恩只是害羞 |
| [24:25] | I see. | 知道了 |
| [24:29] | How do you handle bad behavior? | 你们怎么处理他不好的行为 |
| [24:31] | Nothing extraordinary. | 没什么特别的 |
| [24:33] | Sent to his room, the usual thing. | 让他回房间反省 常规的做法 |
| [24:40] | Corporal punishment? | 体罚呢 |
| [24:41] | – Never. – No. | -从没有过 -没有 |
| [24:58] | Do you have a weapon in the house? | 你们家中有武器吗 |
| [24:59] | I keep my gun in my office. | 我的枪放在办公室 |
| [25:01] | And you keep it locked? | 房门是锁上的吗 |
| [25:02] | At all times. | 一直都是 |
| [25:06] | Brian! | 布莱恩 |
| [25:11] | Brian, come here. | 布莱恩 过来 |
| [25:19] | This is Miss Leland. | 这位是利兰小姐 |
| [25:21] | Ms. Leland. | 叫我利兰女士 |
| [25:24] | Hi, Brian. | 你好 布莱恩 |
| [25:29] | Bri, why don’t you go inside and read some Clifford? | 小布 不如你先进去看一会书 |
| [25:33] | I’ll be right in. | 我马上就进去 |
| [25:35] | Go on. | 去吧 |
| [25:46] | Does he avoid you? | 他会躲着你吗 |
| [25:48] | He’s had a tough few weeks. | 他这几周过得不顺 |
| [25:50] | Ms. Leland, we love Brian. | 利兰女士 我们很爱布莱恩 |
| [25:53] | He may be adopted, but he’s our baby. | 他也许是领养的孩子 但他也是我们的心肝 |
| [25:55] | Of course he is, Mrs. Tench. | 当然了 坦奇太太 |
| [26:00] | At our next appointment, I’ll need the birth certificate, | 下次见面 我需要他的出生证明 |
| [26:02] | his medical records, and all school reports. | 他的病历 以及所有的成绩单 |
| [26:07] | These explain the process. | 这些材料解释了所有流程 |
| [26:12] | Basic child safety guidelines. | 很基本的儿童安全指南 |
| [26:14] | I’ll be stopping by periodically, unannounced, to observe. | 我会定期进行突击拜访观察 |
| [26:17] | We need to establish a baseline | 我们需要为他在这个环境中的表现 |
| [26:19] | for how he behaves in this environment | 确立一个基线 |
| [26:21] | to evaluate his progress. | 来评估他的进步 |
| [26:22] | Then we can determine whether adjustments need to be made. | 这样我们就可以决定是否需要进行调整 |
| [26:25] | What kind of adjustments? | 什么样的调整 |
| [26:26] | We won’t know until we’ve spent some time. | 要观察一段时间后才能确定 |
| [26:28] | Your appointments with Dr. Moritz will be every Friday. | 你们和莫里茨医生的预约在每周五 |
| [26:31] | You’ll both need to attend. | 二位都需要到场 |
| [26:34] | Of course. | 没问题 |
| [26:35] | We’ll submit regular reports to the commonwealth attorney | 我们会把建议写进报告 |
| [26:38] | with our recommendations. | 定期上交给联邦检察官 |
| [26:39] | Ultimately, he’ll make all decisions moving forward. | 最后 将由他做出下一步的所有决定 |
| [26:50] | We’ll see you. | 再见 |
| [26:52] | Yes, you will. | 会再见的 |
| [26:57] | We do the exact same thing. | 我们也会这样 |
| [27:00] | What’s that? | 什么样 |
| [27:02] | Walk the crime scene. | 检查犯罪现场 |
| [27:08] | Don’t get too comfortable around her. | 不要在她面前太松懈了 |
| [27:11] | She’s not our friend. | 她不是我们的朋友 |
| [27:19] | 加州 瓦卡维尔 | |
| [27:34] | Hold it! | 停车 |
| [27:36] | – FBI. – Thank you. | -联调局 -谢谢 |
| [27:45] | You hoping for an autograph? | 你还想要签名 |
| [27:46] | It’s research. | 是为了做研究 |
| [27:48] | Try not to moisten yourself before you get inside. | 你别还没进去就已经兴奋到湿了 |
| [28:10] | It’s gonna be a bit of a wait. | 得等一会了 |
| [28:12] | He’s refusing to come out of his cell. | 他不愿出牢房 |
| [28:14] | I’m stunned. | 惊到我了 |
| [28:16] | – Any chance Kemper’s available? – I can check. | -坎伯有空吗 -我可以查查 |
| [28:18] | No! Not Kemper. | 不 不要坎伯 |
| [28:20] | We came to see Manson. | 我们是来见曼森的 |
| [28:22] | – We’ll wait him out. – Bill, I’ll be fine. | -我们等他出来 -比尔 没事的 |
| [28:25] | You need to ask Kemper about returning | 你得问坎伯回到罪案现场的事 |
| [28:27] | to the scene of the crime, for BTK. | 为了BTK的案子 |
| [28:29] | We know he did that. He told us. | 我们知道他回去过 他告诉过我们 |
| [28:30] | But we need to know why. | 但我们得弄清楚原因 |
| [28:33] | I will be fine. | 我不会有事的 |
| [28:40] | Besides, how’s Manson gonna feel | 再说了 要是曼森知道 |
| [28:42] | when he finds out we’re talking to Kemper? | 我们去找坎伯了会有何想法 |
| [28:45] | These guys are all jealous of each other. | 这些人都彼此嫉妒 |
| [28:48] | For the use of reason | 因为使用理性 |
| [28:48] | 《七洞穴》 卡尔顿・库恩著 | |
| [28:49] | is to justify the obscure desires | 是为了证明那些隐晦的欲望是正当的 |
| [28:53] | that move our conduct, | 是它们推动了我们的行为 |
| [28:55] | impulses, passions, | 冲动 激情 |
| [28:58] | prejudice, and follies. | 偏见和愚蠢 |
| [29:05] | Gentlemen. | 先生们 |
| [29:07] | What a surprise. | 真没想到 |
| [29:12] | – Bill. – Ed. | -比尔 -艾德 |
| [29:15] | Holden. | 霍顿 |
| [29:17] | Good to see you, Ed. | 很高兴见到你 艾德 |
| [29:19] | Have a seat. | 请坐 |
| [29:24] | Do you know that Holden came to see me | 你知道霍顿在我住院时 |
| [29:27] | when I was in the hospital? | 来看我了吗 |
| [29:29] | I’m aware. | 知道 |
| [29:31] | It really meant a lot to me. | 这对我真的意义重大 |
| [29:33] | That’s what friends are for, right? | 朋友间就该如此 对吗 |
| [29:39] | So, Manson, huh? | 你们为曼森而来的吧 |
| [29:42] | Word travels fast. | 消息传得很快 |
| [29:43] | It’s hard to keep something like that quiet. | 那种事很难瞒得了 |
| [29:46] | Everybody knows when Charlie takes a shit. | 查尔斯拉个屎大家都会知道 |
| [29:48] | And if you haven’t heard, he’ll tell you all about it. | 如果你还没听说 他也会告诉你 |
| [29:51] | Even if somebody else took the shit for him. | 即使是别人帮他拉的屎 |
| [29:55] | – Right. – He’s never done that. | -是啊 -他没干过 |
| [29:57] | Doesn’t know what it’s like. | 他根本不知道个中滋味 |
| [29:59] | You’re saying he’s not worth our attention? | 你是说他不值得我们关注吗 |
| [30:01] | The “Mayhem” has been copiously mythologized. | 这场”骚乱”已经被过度神话了 |
| [30:04] | If you really want to understand how that all went down, | 如果你们真的想弄清楚事发经过 |
| [30:07] | you should talk to Tex. | 应该去找泰克斯 |
| [30:09] | – The all-American pawn? – Yeah. | -那个典型美国人的小卒 -对 |
| [30:11] | – I’m sure you’re right, Bill. – We’ll keep that in mind. | -你说的应该就是他 比尔 -我们会记住的 |
| [30:14] | But we didn’t come here to talk about Manson. | 但我们不是来聊曼森的 |
| [30:20] | What did you want to talk about? | 那你们想聊些什么 |
| [30:23] | You, Ed. | 你 艾德 |
| [30:26] | I wanted to ask you about something you said a while back. | 我想问问你之前说过的一件事 |
| [30:29] | About revisiting the sites of your victims. | 你说你会重回受害者被害的地点 |
| [30:33] | Why did you do that? | 你为什么要那样做 |
| [30:36] | Well, at the murder site, I could relive the experience. | 在谋杀现场 我能重新体验杀人经历 |
| [30:39] | Feel the same elation, | 感受到当时的快感 |
| [30:41] | the incredible release. | 那种无与伦比的宣泄感 |
| [30:42] | It excited you. | 那让你兴奋 |
| [30:44] | Yes. | 是的 |
| [30:46] | I would also relive the sexual gratification. | 我还能再次体验那种性满足感 |
| [30:50] | What would make you decide to visit? | 是什么让你决定重回现场的 |
| [30:52] | The feeling of complete dominance, | 彻底的支配感 |
| [30:54] | total possession you get from a kill, | 和杀戮带来的完全占有感 |
| [30:57] | becomes a need. | 成了一种需求 |
| [30:58] | That need builds | 那种需求会越来越强烈 |
| [30:59] | until it becomes a compulsion | 直到变成一种无法抗拒的冲动 |
| [31:01] | to a point that you have to hunt again. | 到了某种程度 你就不得不再次猎杀 |
| [31:04] | Sometimes, I could stave off that need | 有时 我可以通过回忆杀人瞬间 |
| [31:07] | by remembering the moment of the kill. | 来延缓那种需求 |
| [31:10] | You can really savor that when you’re in the exact spot. | 站在同个地点 就能好好享受那滋味 |
| [31:13] | What if you can’t make it to a site? | 要是你无法回到现场呢 |
| [31:15] | Too many people around. | 周围太多人 |
| [31:17] | I kept things. Little trinkets. | 我留下了一些东西 小玩意 |
| [31:19] | Reminders of my experience. | 能让我回忆起杀人场景的东西 |
| [31:21] | The Polaroids. | 拍立得照片 |
| [31:22] | I could hold them. Possess them. | 我可以留着它们 拥有它们 |
| [31:24] | They were souvenirs. | 它们都是纪念品 |
| [31:26] | Was there a specific amount of time, something you could measure, | 有没有一个你能估量的明确时间 |
| [31:28] | when the “souvenirs” weren’t enough? | 你感觉那些”纪念品”不够了 |
| [31:34] | Have you got somebody, Holden? | 你遇到什么人了吗 霍顿 |
| [31:38] | Someone you can’t catch? | 一个你抓不住的人 |
| [31:43] | Is that right, Bill? | 对吗 比尔 |
| [31:44] | Who is it? The East Area Rapist? The San Mateo Slasher? | 是谁 东区强奸犯 圣马特奥杀人狂 |
| [31:48] | I-45 Killer down in Texas? | 还是德州45号州际公路杀手 |
| [31:53] | You’ve found somebody who hasn’t made the news yet. | 你遇到了一个还没被新闻报出来的人 |
| [31:57] | Just startin’ out. | 才刚开始作案 |
| [31:58] | Would you have any thoughts on someone like that? | 你对那样的人有什么想法吗 |
| [32:01] | Of course. | 当然有 |
| [32:04] | But I’d have to be acquainted with the pertinent facts. | 但我必须了解相关事实 |
| [32:07] | We can’t discuss ongoing investigations, Ed. | 我们不能讨论正在调查的案子 艾德 |
| [32:11] | With anyone. | 跟任何人都不行 |
| [32:12] | I’m sure you understand. | 你一定能理解 |
| [32:14] | Of course, Bill. | 当然 比尔 |
| [32:21] | It’s a taxing lifestyle. | 这是种磨人的生活方式 |
| [32:23] | A lot of factors that go into success. | 要成功 有很多因素 |
| [32:27] | As I got better, | 我手法熟练后 |
| [32:29] | I was very careful that all conditions were exactly right. | 就变得异常小心 确保所有条件都具备了 |
| [32:36] | This person you’re after, he has an overwhelming fantasy life. | 你追捕的这个人过着充满幻想的生活 |
| [32:42] | Fantasies of what he’s done, what he wants to do, | 幻想他做过的事 他想做的事 |
| [32:46] | how he’s going to improve. | 以及如何做得更好 |
| [32:50] | These dreams will consume him. | 这些梦会吞噬他 |
| [32:52] | Soon, the real world won’t even compare. | 很快 真实的世界就会无法满足他 |
| [32:57] | How do we catch a fantasy, Ed? | 我们如何抓住一个幻想 艾德 |
| [32:59] | You can’t. If he’s any good, | 抓不到的 如果他足够厉害 |
| [33:02] | you’ll never see it. | 你们就永远发现不了 |
| [33:03] | He’ll live like any other person, | 他会过着和大家一样的普通生活 |
| [33:05] | have relationships, hold down a job. | 找个伴 从事一份工作 |
| [33:07] | We know killers don’t have the tools to manage real life. | 我们知道杀手无法过真实的生活 |
| [33:09] | They come from marginalized backgrounds, | 他们有着边缘化的背景 |
| [33:11] | they break under the pressure of what they’ve done. | 会被自己的所为所带来的压力压垮 |
| [33:13] | They make mistakes. | 他们会犯错 |
| [33:16] | It seems to me everything you know about serial killers | 在我看来似乎你对连环杀手的了解 |
| [33:19] | has been gleaned from the ones who’ve been caught. | 都是来自于那些已经被捕的罪犯 |
| [33:26] | He’s ready. | 他准备好了 |
| [33:29] | Sorry, Ed. | 抱歉 艾德 |
| [33:33] | That’s all right, Bill. | 没关系 比尔 |
| [33:35] | Did you save enough tape for the charlatan? | 你给那个江湖骗子留够录音带了吗 |
| [33:37] | I brought extra. | 我额外带了些 |
| [33:39] | You’ll need it. He’s a talker. | 你会用得上的 他很能说 |
| [33:42] | I’m still trying to write my book. | 我仍然想写书 |
| [33:43] | I just need access to a typewriter. | 能使用打字机就够了 |
| [33:46] | – Yeah, we’ll see what we can do. – Thank you, Bill. | -我们会想办法的 -谢谢你 比尔 |
| [33:48] | See you around. | 再见 |
| [33:51] | One more thing. | 还有件事 |
| [33:53] | Manson is really small. | 曼森个头真的很小 |
| [33:56] | Like, really small. | 非常小 |
| [33:58] | Try not to stare. | 别盯着他看 |
| [34:07] | Suck my dick! | 吸老子的�� |
| [34:12] | That’s my bitch! | 那是我的母狗 |
| [34:17] | Fuck you, man! | 滚蛋 |
| [34:19] | Fuck you! | 去你妈的 |
| [34:24] | Fuck you! Fuck you! | 操你妈 |
| [34:32] | 医务室 | |
| [34:45] | Do you think we should talk to Tex? | 你觉得我们该跟泰克斯聊聊吗 |
| [34:47] | You realize Kemper keeps reeling you in? | 你有没意识到坎伯一直在引你上钩 |
| [34:49] | He’s the most cogent, credible subject we’ve ever interviewed. | 他是我们约谈过的最有说服力 最可信的罪犯了 |
| [34:52] | The bar is low. | 标准本来就不高 |
| [34:53] | If Kemper hadn’t turned himself in, | 如果坎伯不是自首 |
| [34:54] | he could’ve avoided capture for as long as he wanted. | 他本可以尽情地逍遥法外 |
| [34:56] | He’s an incredible resource. | 他是很好的资源 |
| [34:58] | You bought a new microphone. | 你买了新话筒 |
| [35:01] | For posterity. | 为了留给后人 |
| [35:14] | Like a fucking king. | 像个国王一样 |
| [35:21] | Uncuff him, please. | 请给他松铐 |
| [35:33] | All of them. | 全都解开 |
| [35:36] | I’m Special Agent Tench. | 我是特别探员坦奇 |
| [35:38] | This is Special Agent Ford. | 这位是特别探员福特 |
| [35:40] | This isn’t an interrogation, Mr. Manson. | 这不是审问 曼森先生 |
| [35:42] | We know that you didn’t commit the Tate or LaBianca murders. | 我们知道你没有杀害塔特和拉比安卡 |
| [35:45] | What we’re interested in is your relationship with your Family. | 我们感兴趣的是你和你家族之间的关系 |
| [35:48] | And what bearing that relationship had on the crimes. | 以及这种关系对案子的影响 |
| [35:51] | Please. | 请坐 |
| [35:59] | We’d like to hear from you, in your own words, | 我们想听你亲口说 |
| [36:02] | about what happened. | 事情的经过 |
| [36:20] | Do you mind if we record this? | 介意我们录音吗 |
| [36:28] | Over the years, | 这些年来 |
| [36:29] | some members have blamed you for the murders, | 你有些家族成员将谋杀归咎于你 |
| [36:31] | then changed their story. | 然后又改了说法 |
| [36:33] | Others, quite famously, have protected you. | 其他人 则不遗余力地保护你 |
| [36:36] | You seem to have a hold on them even from prison. | 你似乎在监狱中也能控制他们 |
| [36:40] | But no matter what they say, | 但不管他们怎么说 |
| [36:41] | you maintain the same story. | 你的陈述一直没变 |
| [36:44] | Because my truth is simple. | 因为我的真相很简单 |
| [36:46] | – And your truth’s complicated. – Complicated how? | -而你们的真相很复杂 -怎么个复杂法 |
| [36:49] | Well, you don’t see it, but the only truth is now. | 你不明白 但唯一的真相就是现在 |
| [36:52] | Now is the only thing that’s real. | 只有现在才是真实的 |
| [36:54] | Well, we’re mainly interested in then. | 我们主要是对过去感兴趣 |
| [36:57] | How you met, influenced, | 你是怎么认识 影响 |
| [36:59] | and indoctrinated the people who followed you. | 你的追随者 并给他们洗脑的 |
| [37:00] | Indoctrinated? Come on, man. | 洗脑 不是吧 |
| [37:03] | How did the Family begin? | 你的家族是怎么建成的 |
| [37:05] | Did you start with the girls? | 你是先从女孩下手的吗 |
| [37:06] | These people you call the “Family,” | 你们所谓的”家族”成员 |
| [37:08] | they’re just children that you didn’t want. | 只不过是被你们遗弃的孩子 |
| [37:10] | You threw ’em out like trash. | 你们把他们扔进了垃圾堆 |
| [37:11] | So I picked them up off the side of the road, and I said this: | 所以我从路边捡走了他们 我对他们说 |
| [37:14] | in love, there is no wrong. | 没有错误的爱 |
| [37:16] | Love? That’s what you taught your Family? | 爱 你就是这么教你家人的吗 |
| [37:21] | You’re a family man, Agent Tench? | 你有家庭吗 坦奇探员 |
| [37:24] | – Yeah. – Yeah? | -有 -是吗 |
| [37:26] | Yeah, he’s a family man, too, with his keys and his gun. | 对 他也是个有家的人 有钥匙也有枪 |
| [37:29] | He’s teaching his children right now. | 他现在正在教他的孩子们 |
| [37:32] | They’re learning his beliefs, and they’ll be living ’em. | 他们在学习并实践他的信仰 |
| [37:35] | And you, you’re teaching your children. | 而你 你在教你的孩子 |
| [37:38] | Look at yourself, judge the lies you live in. | 看看你自己 审视下你所处的谎言 |
| [37:41] | These children that come at you with knives, | 这些拿着刀冲向你的孩子们 |
| [37:43] | they’re your children. | 是你的孩子 |
| [37:44] | They were your followers, Charlie. You gave them the knife. | 他们是你的追随者 查尔斯 刀是你给他们的 |
| [37:47] | You taught ’em! I didn’t teach ’em. | 这些都是你教的 不是我 |
| [37:49] | I just tried to help ’em stand up. | 我只是想帮他们站起来 |
| [37:51] | And they stood up, went out, and killed seven innocent people. | 他们站起来了 走出门去 杀了七个无辜的人 |
| [37:54] | So now it’s my fault? | 这倒成我的责任了 |
| [37:56] | It’s my fault that your children do what they do? | 你孩子所犯的事该怪我吗 |
| [37:59] | Your own children who you are neglecting? | 他们是你的孩子 被你忽略的孩子 |
| [38:01] | We know that no one in the family | 我们知道你家族中的人 |
| [38:03] | acted without your approval, Charlie. | 没有你允许是不会行动的 查尔斯 |
| [38:04] | Well, if you know, you know. You don’t need to talk to me. | 要是你们都知道了 就不用跟我聊了 |
| [38:08] | It’s yourself you need to talk to. | 只用跟你自己聊就好了 |
| [38:16] | Let’s talk about August 9th, 1969. | 我们来聊聊1969年8月9号的事吧 |
| [38:18] | That is gone in the past. | 那都是过去的事了 |
| [38:19] | And when it is gone, it is gone, brother. | 过去的事已经过去了 兄弟 |
| [38:22] | That summer, you told the Family, | 那个夏天 你跟你的家族说 |
| [38:23] | “Now is the time for Helter Skelter.” | “现在是时候掀起末日混乱了” |
| [38:25] | That they needed to start a race war | 他们要开始谋杀富有的白人 |
| [38:27] | by murdering wealthy white people… | 挑起一场种族战争 |
| [38:28] | That’s the district attorney’s fantasy. That’s his fears. | 那是地方检察官的幻想 那是他的恐惧 |
| [38:31] | That’s a reflection of his fears. | 那反映了他的恐惧 |
| [38:33] | So you’re saying that this never happened? | 那你是说这里面写的都是假的 |
| [38:34] | 《杀人狂曼森》 文森特・布里欧西 及柯特・甘特利著 | |
| [38:35] | Sure, I’m saying that never happened! | 是的 我是说根本没那回事 |
| [38:37] | Bugliosi is a genius, man! | 布里欧西是个天才 |
| [38:37] | 该书作者 亦是曼森案的检察官 | |
| [38:39] | He got everything a prosecutor would want, | 他拥有一个检察官想要的一切 |
| [38:41] | except one thing: a case. | 唯独没有证据立案 |
| [38:44] | He doesn’t have a case! | 他没有证据立案 |
| [38:45] | So he puts Linda Kasabian on the stand, | 所以他让琳达・卡萨宾站上证人席 |
| [38:48] | and she tells a sad story about how she has lied, | 她就讲述了一个悲惨故事 关于她是如何说谎 |
| [38:51] | and cheated, and… | 出轨… |
| [38:52] | And done every dishonest thing that she can think of. | 还有如何做了她能想到的所有不诚实的事情 |
| [38:55] | but it’s okay, she’s telling the truth now. | 但没关系 她现在说实话了 |
| [38:58] | She wouldn’t have any ulterior motive, | 她没有什么未明动机 |
| [39:01] | like immunity for seven counts of murder. | 比如七宗谋杀罪的豁免权 |
| [39:03] | You’re saying she lied? All the witnesses lied? | 你是说她撒了谎 所有的证人都撒了谎 |
| [39:06] | Each witness got up and testified only what was best for them. | 每个证人出来作证 只是为了给自己争取好处 |
| [39:09] | They didn’t testify what was best for me. | 他们可不是为了帮我才作证的 |
| [39:13] | Do you believe this Helter Skelter bullshit? | 你们真的相信”末日混乱” “种族战争”那些屁话吗 |
| [39:15] | “Death to Pigs.” “Political Piggy.” | “白皮猪去死” “政治白皮猪” |
| [39:18] | Got to admit, it sounds like a vision. | 不得不承认 听上去像某种愿景 |
| [39:19] | There’s no vision. | 不存在什么愿景 |
| [39:21] | I might have had an opinion about blacks and whites | 我也许是对黑人白人 还有他们之间的矛盾 |
| [39:24] | and the hassles they were havin’. | 持有自己的看法 |
| [39:25] | But I don’t recall saying anything about starting a race war. | 但我不记得我说过任何要挑起种族战争的话 |
| [39:28] | So how did that become the story? | 所以怎么会出现这种说法 |
| [39:30] | It was Sadie who started hearing messages in the White Album. | 是萨迪从披头士的《白色专辑》里听出来的 |
| [39:33] | She gave the media the material | 她给了媒体那些材料 |
| [39:35] | for any perversion they cared print. | 随他们曲解完了就印出来 |
| [39:38] | The DA grabbed Sadie’s version, | 地检就抓住了萨迪的版本 |
| [39:39] | ran all the way through the courtroom with it: | 在法庭上到处宣扬 |
| [39:41] | “Charles Manson: the most dangerous man alive.” | “查尔斯・曼森 在世的最危险的人” |
| [39:45] | “Hippie cult leader who programmed people to kill.” | “教唆人去杀人的嬉皮邪教头子” |
| [39:48] | In that book, he’s got me so powerful, | 在那本书里 他把我写得无所不能 |
| [39:50] | a look from me stopped his watch! | 我瞟他一眼 他的表都会停止转动 |
| [39:53] | I’d lay there in my cell wondering, | 我就躺在我的牢房里寻思 |
| [39:54] | “Wow, am I really all they say?” | “我真有他们说的那么厉害吗” |
| [39:57] | I was halfway believing that shit myself. | 我自己都快信了那些鬼话了 |
| [40:00] | But I’ve been staring at every clock I see. | 但我从此每见到一个钟都盯着看 |
| [40:02] | And you know what? | 你猜怎么着 |
| [40:03] | As hard as I stare, the clock never stops. | 不管我盯得多用力 那些钟都没停转过 |
| [40:06] | You had a group of teenagers isolated in the desert. | 你让一群青少年在沙漠中与世隔绝 |
| [40:08] | You gave ’em drugs, you convinced ’em you were God, | 你给毒品他们 让他们相信你是上帝 |
| [40:11] | and you sent ’em out to kill. | 然后派他们出去杀人 |
| [40:12] | Listen man, Bobby Beausoleil | 听着 博比・博索莱伊 |
| [40:13] | was sitting in jail for murder, you dig? | 当时因为谋杀在坐牢 你们懂吧 |
| [40:16] | Tex and Sadie came to me | 泰克斯和萨迪来找我 |
| [40:18] | and said, “Let’s do some copycat killings to get him off.” | 说 “我们模仿他的手法干几票 让他被放出来” |
| [40:21] | You’re saying the murders, everything, | 你是说那些谋杀还有你们所做的一切 |
| [40:24] | was just to get Bobby Beausoleil out of prison? | 都只是为了让博比・博索莱伊从牢里出来 |
| [40:26] | Those kids were looking at me with hard eyes. | 那些孩子都冷着脸看我 |
| [40:31] | Yeah, your kids. | 没错 你的孩子们 |
| [40:33] | Tex Watson, the all-American boy? | 泰克斯・沃森 那个典型的美国男孩 |
| [40:35] | The pride of Copeville, Texas? | 德州科普维尔人民的骄傲 |
| [40:37] | I have better sense than to disagree him. | 我还不至于蠢到去反对他 |
| [40:40] | So I said this: | 所以我是这么说的 |
| [40:41] | “You do what your love tells you to do. | “你走你的阳关道 |
| [40:43] | I’ll do what my love tells me.” | 我过我的独木桥” |
| [40:45] | Now whatever he did, that’s up to him. | 不管他做了什么 那都是他的决定 |
| [40:47] | He’ll have to explain it to you. | 得让他给你解释 |
| [40:48] | Just to be clear, | 我就问问清楚 |
| [40:51] | this was their plan? You weren’t responsible… | 这些都是他们的计划吗 你没有责任… |
| [40:53] | You got a circle that a man lives inside of. | 每个人都活在一个圈子里 |
| [40:56] | He’s responsible for his circle and his circle only. | 他为且仅为他自己的圈子负责 |
| [41:00] | Now, I don’t recall saying anything about, | 我不记得我说过任何 |
| [41:02] | “Go get a knife and kill anyone” or anything. | “去拿把刀捅死几个人”这样的话 |
| [41:05] | Bullshit. | 胡扯 |
| [41:07] | If I wanted, I could kill you with your mic cord. | 如果我想 我能用你的话筒线弄死你 |
| [41:11] | With your pencil. | 用你的铅笔也行 |
| [41:12] | But I wanna love myself, so I’m not going to do that. | 但我想爱护自己 所以我不会那么做的 |
| [41:15] | No, you’re gonna put it in someone else’s circle. | 的确不会 你会让其他人来动手 |
| [41:19] | Listen, man. Tex? | 听着 泰克斯这个人呢 |
| [41:20] | It was hard to tell | 成天嗑药 |
| [41:21] | if he was at the end of an old high or startin’ a new one. | 分不清他是刚嗨完还是又开始嗑 |
| [41:24] | Now, I went back to the Cielo Drive house that night, | 那天晚上我回过天堂路的那幢房子 |
| [41:26] | and sent one of the kids inside to see if he’d really done it. | 派了其中一个孩子进去看看他是不是真的把她杀了 |
| [41:29] | Why didn’t you go inside? | 你怎么不进去 |
| [41:30] | It was a crime scene. | 那是个犯罪现场 |
| [41:31] | I’d have been in violation of my parole. | 我进去就会违反我的假释条例 |
| [41:35] | But you were at the LaBianca murders, weren’t you, Charlie? | 但拉比安卡谋杀案你参与了 是吧 查尔斯 |
| [41:38] | I had to go. I had to go. | 我必须得去啊 我不得不去 |
| [41:40] | – You had to? – Yeah. Listen, Tex, | -什么叫必须 -听着 泰克斯这人 |
| [41:42] | he put himself on me, man. | 是他逼我的 |
| [41:44] | He tried to make me look weak. | 他想让我看起来很软弱 |
| [41:46] | We were moving forward inside ourselves. | 我们的内心都在进步 |
| [41:49] | We were learnin’ new things. And he changed it. | 我们在学新东西 结果他改变了一切 |
| [41:51] | See, he went outside. He made his own circle. | 他出去了 他划立了自己的圈子 |
| [41:54] | And, what, now he wants to go back to “Jesus loves me”? | 怎么 他现在又打算回来高喊”耶稣爱我”了 |
| [41:58] | Blood of the lamb, | 弄点圣经里羊血那套 |
| [41:59] | the right/wrong games we played for 2,000 years? | 玩点我们玩了两千年的对错游戏 |
| [42:02] | Right and wrong is a game? | 对错是个游戏吗 |
| [42:04] | There are no rights and wrongs, only ises. | 没有对错 只有存在 |
| [42:07] | Whatever life is, it is. | 无论生命是什么 生命就是生命 |
| [42:09] | Right and wrong got nothing to do with it. | 对错与之无关 |
| [42:11] | So the murder of seven people just “Is”? | 所以死了七个人的谋杀案就只是”存在”吗 |
| [42:15] | Well, it is, isn’t it? | 是的 不是吗 |
| [42:19] | No one ever dies, no one ever lives. | 无人曾死 无人曾活 |
| [42:21] | Those are two words in a leftover game. | 生死不过是一个剩下的游戏中的两个词罢了 |
| [42:23] | People did die, Charlie. You made sure of it. | 确实有人死了 查尔斯 你确保他们死得透透的 |
| [42:25] | Everything is love, man. | 一切皆为爱 |
| [42:27] | There’s nothing that isn’t love. | 没有什么不是爱 |
| [42:28] | Really? | 是吗 |
| [42:29] | Nothin’? | 真的没有吗 |
| [42:31] | How much more of this shit do you wanna listen to? | 你还想听多少这样的屁话 |
| [42:33] | You need to walk on a different street, guy. | 你得换换想法了 伙计 |
| [42:35] | Put your clothes on backwards, and let everyone laugh at you. | 反穿衣服 让大家都笑话你 |
| [42:38] | You’re a coward, Charlie. | 你是个懦夫 查尔斯 |
| [42:39] | A coward who takes no responsibility for his actions. | 敢做不敢当的懦夫 |
| [42:42] | Yeah, you eat meat with your teeth, | 是啊 你用牙吃肉 |
| [42:44] | you kill things that are better than you, | 你杀掉比你优秀的东西 |
| [42:46] | and then you say your children are killers. | 然后你说你的孩子是杀手 |
| [42:48] | No, I’m saying you’re a killer. | 不 要我说你才是杀手 |
| [42:49] | I have killed no one… | 我不曾杀过人… |
| [42:51] | You ordered them to go to that house | 你下令让他们去那幢房子 |
| [42:51] | – and slaughter everyone there. – And I wanted no one to be killed. | -把里面所有人杀光 -我也不想任何人被杀 |
| [42:56] | I did not direct anyone to do anything | 我没有指使任何人做任何事 |
| [42:58] | other than what they wanted to do. | 这都是他们自愿的 |
| [43:00] | You didn’t stop them either. | 你也没有制止他们啊 |
| [43:01] | I always let children go. If he falls, that is how he learns. | 我会对孩子放手 只有跌倒了才会吸取教训 |
| [43:04] | You become strong by fallin’. | 挫折使人强大 |
| [43:06] | You’re not supposed to let children fall. | 你不应该让孩子跌倒 |
| [43:08] | You’re supposed to guide them. | 而是应该给予他们引导 |
| [43:09] | Guide them into what? | 引导他们什么 |
| [43:10] | Guide them into what you’ve guided them into? | 引导他们变成你孩子那样吗 |
| [43:13] | – You fucking midget! – Bill! | -你这个臭侏儒 -比尔 |
| [43:20] | This anger that you’re feeling, Agent Tench, | 坦奇探员 你心中的这团怒火 |
| [43:22] | this is just the anger that you have got for you. | 都是对自己的怨气 |
| [43:24] | Find someone else to put yourself on. | 这气撒给别人去吧 |
| [43:26] | I’m tired of being your goat. | 我受够当你的替罪羊了 |
| [43:28] | I’m tired of being your reflection. | 我受够做你的倒影了 |
| [43:30] | – You’re not my reflection. – I’ve always been yours. | -你才不是我的倒影 -我一直都是 |
| [43:32] | I’ve been in your cell since I was eight years old. | 我从八岁起就住在你的牢笼里 |
| [43:35] | I don’t even have a name. | 我甚至都没有自己的名字 |
| [43:36] | I’m B-33920. | 我叫编号B-33920 |
| [43:39] | A bell rings, I get up! | 铃声一响 我就起床 |
| [43:41] | A bell rings, I go out! | 铃声再响 我就出门 |
| [43:43] | A bell rings, I do what that bell says. | 只要铃声响 我就会照它说的做 |
| [43:46] | I’m Pavlov’s dog, man. | 我就是巴甫洛夫的狗 |
| [43:46] | 俄国著名生理学家巴甫洛夫 做的条件反射实验 | |
| [43:48] | I’m anything you want me to be. | 你觉得我是什么我就是什么 |
| [43:51] | But what you want is a fiend… | 但你真正想要的是一个恶魔 |
| [43:54] | because that’s what you are. | 因为那才是你的本质 |
| [43:56] | See, I never had any say in your world, | 我在你的世界里从来都没有过发言权 |
| [43:59] | you created it. | 这世界是你创造的 |
| [44:02] | How do you feel about those murders? | 你对这些谋杀案的看法 |
| [44:04] | That’s what counts. | 才是最重要的 |
| [44:06] | Happened in your world, not in mine. | 毕竟这发生在你的世界里 与我无关 |
| [44:09] | What “counts” is that you ordered the deaths of seven people. | “重要”的是你下令杀死了七个人 |
| [44:13] | Eight if you count an unborn baby. | 算上腹中惨死的胎儿就是八个 |
| [44:15] | And now you can reflect it back on me, | 你现在也可以做我的倒影了啊 |
| [44:17] | and you can lock me up in your penitentiary, | 你也可以把我关在你的监狱里 |
| [44:20] | and you can say that your world’s better. | 可以说你的世界变得更美好了 |
| [44:23] | But prison’s a frame of thought. | 但监狱不过是思想的框架 |
| [44:25] | We’re all our own prisons, we are each our own wardens, | 我们都活在自己的监狱里 是自己的典狱长 |
| [44:28] | we do our own time. | 都在服刑 |
| [44:30] | Prison is in your mind. | 监狱就在你的脑海里 |
| [44:32] | Can’t you see I’m free? | 你难道没看出来我很自由吗 |
| [44:34] | You don’t look so free to me, Charlie. | 我可没觉得你自由 查尔斯 |
| [44:36] | You don’t look free to me! | 彼此彼此 |
| [44:38] | You look like a composite of what someone told you you are. | 你就像是个集合体 装满了别人对你的评价 |
| [44:42] | You live for other peoples’ opinion, you got pain on your face, | 你为别人的看法而活 脸上带着苦痛 |
| [44:45] | and you wonder if you look okay. | 却连自己的情况都不自知 |
| [44:47] | That’s it. | 我受够了 |
| [44:48] | Bill. | 比尔 |
| [44:51] | Hey, man. | 伙计 |
| [44:52] | I like your sunglasses. | 我喜欢你的墨镜 |
| [44:55] | Can I have ’em? | 能给我吗 |
| [45:06] | Thank you kindly. | 谢谢你了 |
| [45:08] | The guru of Munchkinland can | 在我看来 这个小人国领袖 |
| [45:10] | fuck off straight to hell as far as I’m concerned. | 可以直接滚去地狱了 |
| [45:13] | Agent Ford! | 福特探员 |
| [45:22] | Manson said he lifted these from you. | 曼森说是从你身上顺下来的 |
| [45:24] | – He said he stole them? – He was braggin’ about it. | -他说是偷来的吗 -还在那显摆呢 |
| [45:27] | He’s on his way to the hole. | 他要被关禁闭了 |
| [45:33] | It’s such bullshit. | 一派胡言 |
| [45:35] | What makes more sense? | 哪个说法更合理 |
| [45:37] | Manson being forced to go along with Tex and Sadie’s copycat crime, | 曼森被迫参与泰克斯和萨迪的模仿犯罪 |
| [45:41] | or a race war predicted by the Beatles? | 还是披头士乐队所预见的种族战争 |
| [45:43] | You’re saying the DA lied? | 你的意思是地检说谎了 |
| [45:47] | I’m saying he gave it a narrative. | 我是说他给出了一种说法 |
| [45:49] | He had to explain to a normal, middle-class jury | 他得向普通平凡的中产阶级陪审团说明 |
| [45:53] | how some normal, middle-class kids | 一群平凡普通的中产阶级小孩 |
| [45:54] | brutally murdered seven people. | 是如何残忍杀害七个人的 |
| [45:56] | Jesus, Holden. | 天啊 霍顿 |
| [46:00] | Watson’s an hour away. | 去沃森那就一小时车程 |
| [46:01] | Let’s just spend the night and talk to him. | 我们就在这过夜 去找他谈话吧 |
| [46:03] | I have to get home. | 我得回家 |
| [46:06] | – You can’t spend one more day? – No, I can’t. | -多待一天都不行吗 -不行 |
| [46:09] | And after Atlanta, we can’t fuck up again. | 有亚特兰大的先例 我们可不能再搞砸了 |
| [46:16] | If you stay and do this interview, I need to know, | 如果你一个人留下来去面谈 必须告诉我 |
| [46:20] | can I trust you? | 我能相信你吗 |
| [46:23] | Absolutely. | 当然可以 |
| [46:25] | Just go in, do the interview, come home. Got it? | 完成面谈就直接回家 明白吗 |
| [46:29] | I promise. | 我保证 |
| [46:31] | Thanks, Bill. | 谢了 比尔 |
| [46:35] | Fuck. What time have you got? | 操 你看看几点了 |
| [46:38] | 5:16. | 5点16分 |
| [46:40] | Something wrong with your watch? | 你手表坏了吗 |
| [46:54] | 旧金山国际机场 | |
| [46:57] | Excuse me! | 请问一下 |
| [46:59] | FBI. Is there any way you could hold the plane? | 联调局的 你能让飞机等等再飞吗 |
| [47:01] | I’m sorry, sir. It’s gone. | 抱歉先生 已经起飞了 |
| [47:04] | Is there a red-eye? | 还有红眼航班吗 |
| [47:05] | 10 pm. Arrives in Washington at 6:30. | 晚上十点有一班 早上六点半到特区 |
| [47:09] | Thanks. | 谢谢 |
| [47:32] | I apologize. | 抱歉 |
| [47:34] | I can catch him up on things if you… wanna start. | 你要是着急开始的话 我可以之后帮他补上 |
| [47:37] | The appointment is for the benefit of both parents. | 这次咨询是针对两位家长 |
| [47:43] | I’m sorry. | 对不起 |
| [47:47] | So sorry I’m late. | 非常抱歉 我迟到了 |
| [47:49] | Of course. It happens. | 没关系 常有的事 |
| [47:51] | I just, uh, would be careful | 不过还是得多加注意 |
| [47:53] | being late to appointments with Ms. Leland | 跟利兰女士和联邦检察官见面 |
| [47:55] | or the CA’s office. | 最好不要迟到 |
| [47:57] | What we’re trying to do here is | 我们在这里要做的 |
| [47:58] | avoid as many red flags as we can. | 就是尽可能避免引起他们的担心 |
| [47:59] | Absolutely. | 当然 |
| [48:01] | I’m here to help you both, | 我是来帮助你们二位 |
| [48:03] | and Brian, of course, get through this as easily as possible. | 当然还有布莱恩 尽快度过这个难关的 |
| [48:07] | Thank you. | 谢谢 |
| [48:08] | Now, the goal of our sessions | 我们咨询的目标 |
| [48:09] | will be to glean Brian’s understanding of the event, | 就是详尽搜集布莱恩对此事的认识 |
| [48:12] | his intentions… | 以及他的意图 |
| [48:13] | He didn’t mean to do anything to that little boy. | 他无意伤害那个小男孩 |
| [48:16] | He thought by making a cross… | 他以为做个十字架就能… |
| [48:18] | Mrs. Tench, I… I’m going to need to hear that from Brian. | 坦奇夫人 这些话我得听布莱恩说才行 |
| [48:20] | Well, I think I understand my child. | 我自己的孩子我最了解 |
| [48:23] | Your knowledge of Brian’s behaviors | 你对布莱恩的行为的理解 |
| [48:24] | is going to be essential. | 是非常重要的 |
| [48:26] | But we have to complete the process methodically. | 但我们必须严格按照流程来做 |
| [48:29] | We understand. | 我们明白 |
| [48:33] | Let’s start with homelife. | 我们从家庭生活开始吧 |
| [48:34] | I see, from Ms. Leland, | 据利兰女士说 |
| [48:36] | that your work with the bureau involves some travel. | 你在局里的工作需要经常出差 |
| [48:38] | Your wife tells me you teach “Road school”? | 你妻子说你在巡回教学 是吗 |
| [48:40] | He’s home most of the time now. | 现在他大部分时间在家了 |
| [48:44] | Why exactly were you late, Mr. Tench? | 你到底为什么迟到 坦奇先生 |
| [48:46] | I work in Behavioral Sciences for the FBI. | 我在联调局的行为科学部工作 |
| [48:50] | I don’t know what that means. | 我不知道那是什么 |
| [48:52] | My unit develops procedures for identifying criminals | 我们部门研究如何通过分析罪犯的心理指纹 |
| [48:55] | by their psychological fingerprint. | 找出犯人 |
| [48:57] | And how do you do that? | 你是怎么做的呢 |
| [48:59] | We conduct interviews with convicted felons, | 我们与定罪重刑犯见面 谈话 |
| [49:02] | try to codify their behavior, | 试图将他们的行为归类 |
| [49:04] | gain insight into their mental states. | 了解他们的心理状态 |
| [49:06] | What types of criminals do you deal with? | 你与什么类型的罪犯接触 |
| [49:08] | I study multiple murderers. | 我研究的是杀人累犯 |
| [49:19] | And were you interviewing an actual murderer this morning? | 今天上午你是去见杀人犯了吗 |
| [49:23] | I was late because I was in California | 我迟到是因为我去加州 |
| [49:25] | interviewing Charles Manson. | 约谈查尔斯・曼森了 |
| [49:29] | Manson? | 曼森 |
| [49:30] | Yes, sir. | 是的 先生 |
| [49:33] | Wait. You spoke directly with Charles Manson? | 等等 你和查尔斯・曼森面对面谈话了 |
| [49:37] | Wow. He is quite the character, isn’t he? | 他可不是个一般人 对吧 |
| [49:40] | You ain’t kiddin’. | 你说得很对 |
| [49:41] | Yeah, I… I must admit, | 我…我必须承认 |
| [49:42] | I’m very intrigued by what that conversation was like. | 我对你们的对话内容非常好奇 |
| [49:46] | Could you share any tidbits? | 你能稍微讲一讲吗 |
| [49:49] | Sure. | 当然 |
| [49:51] | 沃森 | |
| [49:51] | Now that I’ve been in here a while, | 我进来也好长时间了 |
| [49:54] | I understand Charlie a whole lot better. | 我对查尔斯有了更全面的了解 |
| [49:56] | How so? | 怎样的了解 |
| [49:58] | It’s survival. | 他是为了生存 |
| [50:00] | Charlie’s not a tough guy, | 查尔斯不是个坚强的人 |
| [50:01] | so he created a prophet persona. | 于是他创造出一个先知的形象 |
| [50:04] | A false prophet, for sure. | 当然了 是假先知 |
| [50:06] | Nothing he ever said came true except for the things we did. | 除了我们所做的事 他说的话没一句成真的 |
| [50:11] | But he could convince you of things you never thought possible. | 但他能让你相信你以前认为绝无可能的事 |
| [50:15] | We didn’t know if he was Jesus or the Devil, but… | 我们不知道他是天神还是恶魔 |
| [50:19] | either was better than facing the world alone. | 但跟着他总好过独自面对这个世界 |
| [50:21] | But you didn’t grow up alone. | 但你小时候并不是孤身一人 |
| [50:23] | You said you had a loving family. | 你说过你的家庭充满爱 |
| [50:25] | You must have developed a moral compass | 你在遇见查尔斯之前肯定已经 |
| [50:26] | before you ever met Charlie. | 建立了一定的道德准则 |
| [50:29] | Let’s just say Charlie had a way of | 只能说查尔斯有本事 |
| [50:31] | making you think things were your idea. | 让我们把他的想法当做自己的想法 |
| [50:34] | He’d start small, like, he’d gather us in a circle, | 他会从小事开始 会叫我们围成一圈 |
| [50:38] | and he’d put a chair in the middle, | 然后在中间放一把椅子 |
| [50:41] | and he would tell us to imagine there was a person in that chair | 让我们想象椅子上坐着人 |
| [50:44] | and that we had to scare them to death. | 而我们需要把这个人吓死 |
| [50:47] | Staring at ’em. Screaming at ’em. | 盯着他 对他尖叫 |
| [50:49] | An empty chair? | 一把空椅子 |
| [50:50] | But in our minds, | 但对我们来说 |
| [50:51] | they were sirens of the apocalypse sittin’ there. | 椅子上坐的就是世界末日的妖魔 |
| [50:53] | Charlie would talk about things we might do to them. | 查尔斯会说起我们要对他们做的事 |
| [50:57] | Like, break into their houses, | 比如闯进他们家 |
| [51:00] | tie them up, kill their families. | 把他们绑起来 杀掉他们的家人 |
| [51:03] | Those ideas, they were only ours because they were his first. | 我们会产生那些想法 都是他灌输给我们的 |
| [51:07] | Once we incorporated them, | 一旦我们接受了这些想法 |
| [51:08] | he’d send us out creepy-crawling. | 他就会派我们去做恐惧潜行 |
| [51:10] | Sorry. What is creepy-crawling? | 抱歉 什么是恐惧潜行 |
| [51:12] | It’s what Charlie called it, | 这是查尔斯的说法 |
| [51:14] | sneakin’ into people’s houses, | 就是偷偷溜进别人家 |
| [51:16] | movin’ furniture around. | 搬动家具之类的 |
| [51:18] | He said it would help us face our fears, go beyond them. | 他说这能帮我们克服恐惧 战胜畏难心理 |
| [51:22] | But Charlie was giving us so many drugs, | 但查尔斯给我们吸了太多毒品 |
| [51:24] | we didn’t know what fear was. | 我们都不知道恐惧是什么了 |
| [51:25] | He gave them to you? | 毒品是他给你们的吗 |
| [51:26] | 都是致幻类药物 | |
| [51:26] | Belladonna, Orange Sunshine, STP. | 颠茄 橙色阳光 STP |
| [51:30] | By the time Charlie said Helter Skelter was coming, | 等到查尔斯宣布”末日混乱”就要降临时 |
| [51:32] | we were doin’ really heavy stuff. | 我们已经在吸最重口的毒品了 |
| [51:34] | Charlie talked about Helter Skelter? | 是查尔斯提起的”末日混乱”吗 |
| [51:36] | All the time. | 经常提起 |
| [51:37] | He told us Helter Skelter was concocted by the district attorney. | 他跟我们说 “末日混乱”是地检官捏造的 |
| [51:41] | From the moment I met him, | 从我认识他的那一刻起 |
| [51:42] | Charlie was talkin’ about a race war. | 查尔斯就在说种族战争的事 |
| [51:44] | We lived every day thinking the world was about to end. | 我们每天都觉得世界末日就要降临了 |
| [51:48] | There is freedom in that. | 这么想会轻松很多 |
| [51:50] | If there’s no tomorrow, there’s no consequences. | 如果未来不存在了 谁还会在乎后果 |
| [51:53] | Does it matter what you do on your last day on earth? | 马上就要死了 谁会在乎自己做的是善是恶 |
| [51:57] | What crimes might you commit, Agent Ford? | 你又会犯下怎样的罪行呢 福特探员 |
| [51:59] | I’d like to think I’d still know right from wrong. | 我宁愿相信自己还能明辨是非 |
| [52:02] | By then, there was no wrong. | 到那时 已经没有是非之分了 |
| [52:03] | I had no conscience. That had been taken from me. | 我没有良知 我的良知已经被泯灭了 |
| [52:06] | By Charlie? | 被查尔斯吗 |
| [52:08] | Charlie said you and Sadie came up with the murders | 查尔斯说是你和萨迪想出了模仿杀人 |
| [52:10] | as a way of getting Bobby Beausoleil out of prison. | 为了把博比・博索莱伊弄出监狱 |
| [52:14] | You have to understand, we were all one. | 你要明白 我们是一体的 |
| [52:16] | We were part of the all. | 我们都是一个整体的一部分 |
| [52:18] | We thought the same thoughts. | 我们有相同的想法 |
| [52:20] | Charlie kept saying | 查尔斯总是说 |
| [52:21] | that if blackie didn’t start Helter Skelter soon, | 要是黑人不能尽快挑起”末日混乱” |
| [52:24] | then we’d have to show ’em how. | 我们就得做给他们看 |
| [52:26] | He chose Cielo Drive because he’d been there before. | 他选了天堂路 是因为他从前去过那儿 |
| [52:28] | – So that was his idea. – They were all his ideas. | -所以是他的主意 -全都是他的主意 |
| [52:32] | But he didn’t go with you. | 但他没有跟你们一起去 |
| [52:33] | Charlie wasn’t about getting his hands dirty. | 查尔斯才不会脏了自己的手 |
| [52:36] | He did go to the house. | 可他确实去了现场 |
| [52:37] | Only after it was all over. | 脏活都干完了他才去的 |
| [52:42] | Did Charlie give you or the girls any specific orders? | 查尔斯有没有给你或女孩们下过明确的命令 |
| [52:46] | He told me to kill everyone. | 他让我杀了所有人 |
| [52:48] | He said, “Make it as gruesome as you can.” | 他说”场面弄得越可怕越好” |
| [52:51] | Told me, “Kill ’em all.” | 叫我”杀光他们” |
| [52:54] | And you did. | 你就这么做了 |
| [52:55] | Yes, sir. | 是的 长官 |
| [53:03] | I remember… being in the car. | 我还记得 坐在车里 |
| [53:07] | I had so many drugs in my system, | 我吸了太多毒品 |
| [53:09] | my mind kept phasing in and out. | 时而清醒 时而恍惚 |
| [53:12] | I was lyin’ with my head in Sadie’s lap. | 我的头枕在萨迪的腿上 |
| [53:17] | She shook me and told me to cut the phone lines. | 她摇了摇我 叫我去剪断电话线 |
| [53:21] | Next thing I remember, we were walkin’ up the drive. | 然后 我不记得我们怎么就走到了车道上 |
| [53:25] | There were headlights, and Sadie hollered, “Get him.” | 车灯开着 萨迪大喊 “干掉他” |
| [53:30] | I looked down, | 我低头一看 |
| [53:31] | I had a gun in my hand, | 手里拿着把枪 |
| [53:32] | so I stuck it in the window | 于是就把枪伸进了窗户 |
| [53:34] | and I pulled the trigger. | 扣动了扳机 |
| [53:35] | There was no thought. No feeling at all. | 我根本没动脑子 完全没有感觉 |
| [53:38] | Eighteen-year-old Steven Parent. | 18岁的斯蒂文・帕伦特 |
| [53:40] | That was the first true sin of my life. | 那是我人生中第一次犯下真正的罪孽 |
| [53:44] | But I’ve repented of it. | 但我已经悔改了 |
| [53:45] | God’s grace has blessed my soul | 上帝仁慈 用他的宽恕之心 |
| [53:47] | with the peace of his forgiveness. | 安抚了我的灵魂 |
| [53:48] | You said you felt nothing? | 你说你当时完全没有感觉 |
| [53:50] | Because death didn’t matter to us. | 因为我们不在乎死亡 |
| [53:54] | Okay. | 好吧 |
| [53:59] | What happened in the house? | 房子里都发生了什么 |
| [54:03] | I remember following Sadie inside. | 我记得我跟着萨迪进去 |
| [54:07] | There was a man asleep on the couch, | 里边有个男人睡在沙发上 |
| [54:11] | it was quiet. | 屋里很安静 |
| [54:14] | Then people started coming in from other rooms. | 然后不断有人从其他房间走出来 |
| [54:17] | A man was comin’ at me, yellin’. | 一个男的走到我跟前 大喊大叫 |
| [54:19] | I… I had the gun, so I shot him. | 我拿着枪 就开枪打了他 |
| [54:23] | Everything just busted open. | 气氛一下就炸锅了 |
| [54:25] | Women were screamin’. | 女人在尖叫 |
| [54:26] | We were stabbin’ people, runnin’ around. | 我们拿着刀捅人 四处乱跑 |
| [54:30] | There was blood everywhere. | 到处都是血 |
| [54:31] | Did you feel anything then? | 那时你有什么感觉吗 |
| [54:33] | Sadie had to kick me to get me going. | 萨迪踹了我 我才能继续下去 |
| [54:35] | But you… got going. | 但你 还是继续了 |
| [54:38] | You have to remember, those people, they were just shapes. | 你要知道 那些人不过是些人形的靶子 |
| [54:42] | They had no faces. | 他们没有脸 |
| [54:44] | Sadie was outside hollerin’ for me. | 萨迪在外面喊我 |
| [54:46] | She had this woman pinned on the lawn… | 她把一个女人摁在了草地上 |
| [54:49] | so I stabbed her. | 我就捅了她 |
| [54:50] | You stabbed Abigail Folger… 28 times. | 你刺了阿比盖尔・福尔杰…28刀 |
| [54:55] | Yeah. | 是的 |
| [54:57] | She was… practically dead when I got there. | 我过去的时候她基本已经没气了 |
| [55:02] | Frykowski had 51 stab wounds. | 弗莱考斯基有51处刀伤 |
| [55:05] | I remember the knife going up and down, like, | 我只记得刀子上下来回地动 |
| [55:10] | a hammer in an engine block | 就像发动机里的活塞那样 |
| [55:11] | until my fist disappeared in the mess. | 直到我的拳头上全是血污 |
| [55:16] | And then? | 然后呢 |
| [55:18] | And then we went into the living room. | 然后我们就进了卧室 |
| [55:23] | Where Sharon Tate was. | 莎朗・塔特在那里 |
| [55:28] | Could you see she was pregnant? | 你看得出她怀孕了吗 |
| [55:30] | Oh, yeah. | 当然 |
| [55:30] | If there are any problems, I’m gonna talk to him about it. | 如果有问题 我会跟他谈的 |
| [55:32] | They’re gonna try. | 他们会试试的 |
| [55:40] | She begged us to take her with us, | 她求我们把她带走 |
| [55:43] | let her have her baby and kill her after. | 让她生下孩子后再杀她 |
| [55:53] | Tex? | 泰克斯 |
| [55:57] | It didn’t seem crazy at the time, the idea of takin’ her. | 当时没觉得带走她这个主意有什么不对 |
| [56:00] | But I kept hearing Charlie’s voice, | 但查尔斯的声音一直在我耳边回响 |
| [56:02] | “Kill ’em all.” | “杀光他们” |
| [56:04] | He told me over and over again, “Make sure everyone’s dead.” | 他一遍又一遍地说 “一个活口也别留” |
| [56:08] | So you made sure. | 你就照做了 |
| [56:10] | I did what Charlie told me. | 我按查尔斯吩咐的做了 |
| [56:13] | Except go to the other houses. | 不过我没有去其他人家 |
| [56:15] | What other houses? | 什么其他人家 |
| [56:16] | Charlie had given us a list, but… I was tired. | 查理给了我们一张单子 但…我累了 |
| [56:20] | It’s hard stabbin’ people, Agent Ford. | 用刀刺人很难 福特探员 |
| [56:22] | Sometimes you hit bone. My hands were aching. | 有时会撞上骨头 我的手很疼 |
| [56:27] | So we went back to the ranch, and… | 所以我们就回了牧场 然后… |
| [56:30] | and I slept like a baby. | 我像婴儿一样倒头大睡 |
| [56:33] | Tex, do you think you would have ever killed anyone | 泰克斯 你觉得要是没遇上查尔斯 |
| [56:36] | if you hadn’t met Charlie? | 你还会杀人吗 |
| [56:38] | I hope not. | 希望不会 |
| [56:40] | I pray to God I wouldn’t have, but… | 我向上帝祈祷我不会 但是… |
| [56:44] | I know, in my heart, I harbored anger. | 我知道 我心里藏着怒火 |
| [56:46] | I shot and I stabbed them. | 我开枪打他们 用刀捅他们 |
| [56:49] | I beat Frykowski’s head with a pistol | 我用手枪砸弗莱考斯基的脑袋 |
| [56:51] | until it broke in my hand. | 直到枪把都断了 |
| [56:52] | But Charlie told you to do it. | 但这是查尔斯让你做的 |
| [56:54] | Charlie never killed anyone. | 查尔斯从未亲手杀人 |
| [56:57] | He just removed our fear of doin’ it. | 他只是除去了我们对杀人的恐惧 |
| [57:00] | So you’re taking responsibility. | 所以你认为责任在你 |
| [57:03] | I killed those people. | 那些人是我杀的 |
| [57:06] | All of them. | 全部都是 |
| [57:07] | Those people are victims of the Watson murders. | 他们都是沃森杀人案的受害者 |
| [57:11] | But the Bible tells us, all have sinned, | 但圣经说 世人皆有罪 |
| [57:13] | and all fall short of the glory of God. | 失掉了上帝的荣耀 |
| [57:16] | He who confesses obtains mercy. | 认罪悔改之人必得怜悯 |
| [57:18] | I was lost… until I gave myself to the Lord. | 我曾经迷失了 直到我将自己献给了主 |
| [57:21] | But now, I’ve been redeemed by the perfect blood of Christ. | 而现在 耶稣的圣血已将我救赎 |
| [57:26] | First Manson and then Jesus. | 先是曼森 然后是耶稣 |
| [57:28] | He’s just exchanged one belief system for another. | 他不过是把一个信仰换成了另一个信仰 |
| [57:32] | See, the contradicting stories don’t concern me. | 我不觉得矛盾说法有什么关系 |
| [57:34] | Neither is a completely reliable source. | 这俩消息源都不可靠 |
| [57:37] | And I’m not so sure that Manson was a total loss. | 我也不觉得曼森那边毫无价值 |
| [57:40] | He had influence over his young followers | 他对他年轻的追随者有影响力 |
| [57:42] | much in the same way that Corll had over Henley. | 跟科尔对亨里的影响很类似 |
| [57:44] | He used sex and drugs. | 他用到了性和毒品 |
| [57:46] | But he also had an overt philosophy. | 但他也拿出了一套鲜明的哲理 |
| [57:49] | If you can call it that. | 这叫什么哲理 |
| [57:50] | What is Helter Skelter, really? | 说真的 到底什么是”末日混乱” |
| [57:53] | It’s borrowed. | 这是借来的词 |
| [57:54] | But how is it useful to him? | 但这对他有什么用 |
| [57:56] | What if the point of Helter Skelter wasn’t a race war? | 如果”末日混乱”的重点并不是种族大战呢 |
| [57:59] | What if it was about control? | 如果是用来控制他人呢 |
| [58:01] | – Over the Family? – A cause to forge solidarity. | -控制曼森家族 -让他们团结一心的理由 |
| [58:04] | What if Tex and Sadie did | 如果确实是泰克斯和萨迪 |
| [58:05] | come up with the idea of a copycat crime? | 提出了模仿作案的想法呢 |
| [58:08] | It’s proactive, risky, revolutionary. | 这个想法有前瞻性 冒险 又新颖 |
| [58:10] | It may not have been what Manson intended, | 也许曼森本来并没有这打算 |
| [58:12] | but they called his bluff. | 但他们逼着他实施 |
| [58:14] | They were doing what he only talks about. | 他只是动动嘴 而他们真的动手了 |
| [58:16] | From Manson’s perspective, | 从曼森的角度看 |
| [58:19] | his authority would have been threatened. | 他的权威会受到威胁 |
| [58:20] | He’d have no choice but to go along with it. | 他没得选 只能顺着他们 |
| [58:22] | At the LaBianca house, | 在拉比安卡家 |
| [58:23] | Manson went in and tied up the victims | 曼森先进去绑住了受害人 |
| [58:25] | before sending the killers in. | 然后才让行凶者进去 |
| [58:26] | He wanted to remind them that this was his plan. | 他想要提醒他们 这是他的计划 |
| [58:29] | Not anyone else’s. | 不是别人的 |
| [58:30] | He was doing whatever he could to keep authority over his Family. | 他尽自己所能 保住他在家族里的权威地位 |
| [58:33] | Control, or at least the appearance of it, was worth any cost. | 控制 那怕只是表面的 也值得他不惜任何代价 |
| [58:37] | Even seven murders. | 包括杀七个人 |
| [58:39] | When we were leaving, he did a weird thing. | 在我们临走时 他做了一件怪事 |
| [58:42] | He asked for my sunglasses, so I gave them to him. | 他管我要墨镜 所以我就给了他 |
| [58:44] | A guard chased me down and said | 一个狱警追上我跟我说 |
| [58:45] | Manson bragged to everyone he stole them from the FBI. | 曼森跟大家吹牛说这是他从联调局的人手里偷来的 |
| [58:49] | He was willing to go to the hole just to look powerful. | 他为了展示自己很厉害 不惜被关禁闭室 |
| [58:51] | On the one hand, you have a bunch of drugged-out kids. | 一边是一群被毒品控制的孩子 |
| [58:53] | On the other, a practiced, manipulative ex-con. | 另一边是一个经验老道 擅长操控人的前罪犯 |
| [58:59] | And you’re arguing that Manson was forced into it? | 你还争辩说曼森是被迫的 |
| [59:02] | Tex gave a pretty detailed account of succumbing to brainwashing. | 泰克斯详细地描述了被洗脑的过程 |
| [59:05] | He didn’t dismiss the idea | 他也没断定 |
| [59:06] | that he would’ve killed without meeting Manson. | 如果他没遇到曼森就不会杀人 |
| [59:08] | Manson found the right people. | 曼森找到了合适的人选 |
| [59:09] | Young, submissive, alone. | 年轻 顺从 孤身一人 |
| [59:11] | But primarily, people with untapped potential. | 但首先 这些人有未开发的潜力 |
| [59:14] | People who saw themselves as outliers. | 他们把自己看作边缘人 |
| [59:16] | People who only had to have their fear | 只要恐惧被消除了 |
| [59:18] | removed to do what they did. | 他们就能做出那些事 |
| [59:19] | He simply helped them be who they were. | 他只是帮他们做真实的自己 |
| [59:26] | Hi. | 嗨 |
| [59:29] | – Escort me in? – Nancy not coming? | -跟我一起进去吧 -南茜不来吗 |
| [59:33] | Didn’t want to drag her to another office thing. | 不想又逼她参加工作上的聚会 |
| [59:35] | – You? – Same. | -你呢 -一样 |
| [59:38] | So, how painful do you think… | 所以 你觉得这个活动… |
| [59:39] | this thing is gonna be? | 会有多难熬 |
| [59:41] | From the look of the house, at least the booze will be good. | 这房子很豪华 至少会有好酒 |
| [59:47] | Welcome. | 欢迎 |
| [59:49] | Come on in. | 请进 |
| [59:51] | Everyone’s in the living room. | 大家都在客厅 |
| [59:52] | AD Wyman’s already here. | 怀曼副局长已经到了 |
| [59:55] | I’ve been giving him a little warm-up. | 我已经大致跟他介绍了一下 |
| [59:55] | Saving the best parts for you, of course. | 当然 精华部分还是留给你们说 |
| [59:58] | Remember, all they want is a good war story. | 记住 他们想要的只是一个精彩的战争故事 |
| [1:00:01] | Got a few of those. | 那我的确有几个 |
| [1:00:04] | Bill, go ahead in. I’ll be right there. | 比尔 你先进去 我随后就到 |
| [1:00:08] | Thank you. | 谢谢 |
| [1:00:09] | Shilling for the FBI probably | 帮联调局游说 |
| [1:00:10] | is not what you expected to be roped into. | 可能跟你当初加入时预想的不一样 |
| [1:00:12] | it’s fine. I did plenty of it at BU. | 没事 这种事我在波士顿大学做过很多 |
| [1:00:14] | Well, I appreciate it. | 我很感谢 |
| [1:00:16] | And I do want you to have a good time. | 真心希望你今晚玩得开心 |
| [1:00:19] | Speaking of which, | 说到这个 |
| [1:00:19] | there’s someone I would love for you to meet. Warren. | 我想介绍你认识一个人 沃伦 |
| [1:00:24] | This is Dr. Wendy Carr. | 这位是温迪・卡尔博士 |
| [1:00:27] | It is a pleasure, Dr. Carr. | 幸会 卡尔博士 |
| [1:00:29] | Warren is our liaison with the LEAA, | 沃伦是我们和司法协助局的联络员 |
| [1:00:31] | so basically, he manages our purse strings. | 所以基本上 掌管着我们的财政大权 |
| [1:00:33] | The good news is, I’m already a fan, | 好消息是 我早就是你们的粉丝了 |
| [1:00:35] | so there’s no need to sell me. | 所以你不用游说我 |
| [1:00:36] | Whew. Well, that’s a relief. | 那我可松了一口气 |
| [1:00:38] | Let me have a drink sent over. What will you have? | 我去点酒 你喝什么 |
| [1:00:40] | A glass of white wine, thank you. | 一杯白葡萄酒 谢谢 |
| [1:00:44] | So you actually read our reports? | 你真的读过我们的报告吗 |
| [1:00:46] | They are so much more interesting than budget committee minutes. | 它们可比预算委员会的会议记录有趣多了 |
| [1:00:50] | That’s a low standard. | 那标准也太低了 |
| [1:00:51] | Well, I really have read them, Doctor… | 我真的读过了 博士 |
| [1:00:55] | – May I call you Wendy? – Of course. | -我能叫你温迪吗 -当然 |
| [1:00:57] | I’ve read the transcripts. | 我读过转录文本了 |
| [1:00:58] | I’ve read the analyses, and they’re fascinating. | 也读了分析 太精彩了 |
| [1:01:00] | And truly original. | 而且极具原创性 |
| [1:01:02] | We were asked to keep our “Originality” | 我们在创办之初 曾被吩咐 |
| [1:01:03] | in the basement when we started. | “原创性”只限在地下室出现 |
| [1:01:04] | It must have been quite a shock, | 你当时一定很震惊 |
| [1:01:06] | coming from the world of scholarship and daylight | 从光明正大的学术世界 |
| [1:01:09] | into a bunker full of G-men. | 来到满是男探员的阴暗地下室 |
| [1:01:11] | I’m doing work that I wouldn’t be able to do anywhere else. | 我现在的工作是独一无二的 |
| [1:01:13] | You are hardly what I expected from the | 我读过你著的《卡尔博士评艾德・坎伯的分尸幻想》 |
| [1:01:16] | “Dr. Carr commentary on Ed Kemper’s Mutilation Fantasies.” | 你跟我预期的不一样 |
| [1:01:19] | Well, I’m afraid to ask what you expected. | 我不太敢问你是怎么想的 |
| [1:01:21] | Something not so form-fitted. | 不会穿这么合身 |
| [1:01:26] | A lot more tweed. | 而是穿花呢衣服 |
| [1:01:31] | George, this is Special Agent Bill Tench. | 乔治 这位是特别探员比尔・坦奇 |
| [1:01:34] | Founder of our Behavioral Science Unit. | 我们行为科学部的创始人 |
| [1:01:36] | I was telling George I only know the boring admin side. | 我跟乔治说 我只负责无聊的行政工作 |
| [1:01:39] | You are the guy who sits in the room with the serial killers. | 你才是跟连环杀手们共处一室的人 |
| [1:01:42] | That’s me, sir. | 就是我 长官 |
| [1:01:43] | Amazing. Ted says no cuffs on these guys. Is that right? | 太厉害了 泰德说那些人都没戴手铐 是吗 |
| [1:01:46] | Makes ’em feel like we really want to hear their side of the story. | 为了让他们觉得 我们真心想听他们的说法 |
| [1:01:49] | Bill has been able to get things out of Speck, Berkowitz, even Manson, | 比尔让斯派克 伯科威茨 甚至曼森 |
| [1:01:53] | that they have never said to anybody else. | 说出了之前没跟任何人说过的话 |
| [1:01:56] | We went into Berkowitz thinking | 我们去见伯科威茨时 还以为 |
| [1:01:57] | we were just going to hear that same old demon, barking dog story. | 只会听到他讲过无数遍的魔鬼和狂吠的狗的故事 |
| [1:02:01] | What could we possibly learn from a guy that crazy? | 我们能从那种疯子身上学到什么呢 |
| [1:02:03] | But we got him to admit that the whole demon thing | 但是我们让他承认了魔鬼那套说辞 |
| [1:02:06] | was totally made up. | 都是编出来的 |
| [1:02:07] | – He said that? – A complete crock. | -他亲口说的吗 -完全是胡说八道 |
| [1:02:10] | And he said the shrinks ate it up faster than anybody. | 他还说心理医生相信得比谁都快 |
| [1:02:15] | But hiding in a basement or hiding behind a typewriter, | 但藏在地下室里 或藏在打字机后面 |
| [1:02:18] | you know, what else do you enjoy? | 有什么好的呢 |
| [1:02:20] | I don’t consider either of those things “Hiding.” | 我没把这些事看做是”隐藏” |
| [1:02:22] | What I mean is, | 我的意思是 |
| [1:02:24] | you have a very compelling presence. | 你是个非常引人注目的人 |
| [1:02:27] | Spending all your time in such solitary pursuits, | 你把时间都花在如此孤独的工作上 |
| [1:02:30] | you may not even be aware of your… | 也许你自己都没意识到 |
| [1:02:33] | your effect on people. | 你对人们所造成的影响 |
| [1:02:39] | What are we doing here? | 我们待在这干什么 |
| [1:02:41] | – Well, every job has its politics. – What I mean is, | -每个工作都要掺杂点政治活动 -我是说 |
| [1:02:44] | we could be somewhere else, together. | 我们可以一起去别的地方 |
| [1:02:47] | I’d like to be alone with you. | 我想跟你独处 |
| [1:02:50] | Warren, no, thank you. | 沃伦 不了 谢谢 |
| [1:02:53] | – We could be really enjoying ourselves. – Holden! | -我们会相处得很开心的 -霍顿 |
| [1:02:57] | This is Special Agent Holden Ford | 这位是特别探员霍顿・福特 |
| [1:03:00] | who’s also with Behavioral Science. | 他也是行为科学部的 |
| [1:03:02] | This is Warren… | 这位是沃伦… |
| [1:03:03] | Freeman. Justice liaison. | 弗里曼 司法部联络员 |
| [1:03:05] | – Hi. – Hi. | -你好 -你好 |
| [1:03:06] | Were you looking for the bar? | 你是在找吧台吗 |
| [1:03:08] | ‘Cause I was thinking about getting myself a refill, | 我正好要去续杯 |
| [1:03:10] | but I’m just gonna stop off at the ladies’ room, first. | 不过得我先去用下洗手间 |
| [1:03:12] | I’ll get your drink, and we can finish our conversation. | 我帮你拿酒 然后我们接着聊 |
| [1:03:21] | It’s this way. | 这边走 |
| [1:03:22] | – Thank you. – Yeah. | -谢谢 -嗯 |
| [1:03:25] | The guard said he bragged | 狱警说他还在吹嘘 |
| [1:03:27] | he’d stolen sunglasses from an FBI agent. | 自己偷了一副联调局探员的墨镜 |
| [1:03:30] | They threw him in solitary. | 然后就被关禁闭了 |
| [1:03:33] | Rather than say they were a gift… There he is! | 根本没说这是别人送的礼物 总算来了 |
| [1:03:36] | He preferred to do six weeks in the hole | 他宁愿关六个礼拜的禁闭 |
| [1:03:38] | just to look like he was a badass. | 也要显得自己很牛掰 |
| [1:03:41] | Gentlemen, this is Special Agent Ford. | 先生们 这位是特别探员福特 |
| [1:03:43] | He’s been key in developing | 我们目前 |
| [1:03:44] | many of the techniques we now use in the field. | 采用的许多方法都是由他主导开发的 |
| [1:03:46] | Bill’s been regaling us. | 比尔在给我们讲段子呢 |
| [1:03:47] | You must have some amazing stories too. | 你肯定也有不少精彩的故事吧 |
| [1:03:50] | I’ve had many of the same experiences Bill’s had. | 我的很多经历都跟比尔的相同 |
| [1:03:53] | I’ll leave you in Agent Ford’s hands. | 那就把你们交给福特探员了 |
| [1:03:55] | Excuse me while I take a leak. | 我去下洗手间 失陪 |
| [1:04:05] | What’s important in the Manson story | 在曼森的描述中 很重要的一点是 |
| [1:04:07] | is that we’re learning what compulsions motivate behavior. | 我们能了解到何种强烈冲动会激发行为 |
| [1:04:11] | For him, it was the appearance of control. | 对他来说 是表现出控制权 |
| [1:04:13] | His crimes can be boiled down to that singular need. | 他所犯的罪行都可以归结于这一需求 |
| [1:04:17] | By correlating psychological fingerprints to known behaviors, | 通过将心理指纹与已知行为进行关联 |
| [1:04:20] | we’re building a primer to understanding criminal action. | 我们就能为日后理解犯罪活动打下基础 |
| [1:04:46] | How did you escape the dog and pony show? | 你是怎么逃出这场马戏的 |
| [1:04:50] | You know, it’s cheating to hide with the wives. | 躲在一群太太里面算作弊哦 |
| [1:04:54] | Warren Freeman. | 沃伦・弗里曼 |
| [1:04:56] | You know him? | 你认识他吗 |
| [1:04:57] | Oh, yeah. | 那可不 |
| [1:04:59] | He’s popular in the secretary pool and the wives’ club. | 他在秘书圈和主妇俱乐部里可受欢迎了 |
| [1:05:03] | How’d you get away? | 你是怎么脱身的 |
| [1:05:04] | I… I grabbed on to the first passing body. | 抓着第一个过路的人不放呗 |
| [1:05:06] | Happened to be Holden. | 正好那个人是霍顿 |
| [1:05:09] | That bad, huh? | 这么惨的吗 |
| [1:05:10] | I should’ve known. | 我应该料到的 |
| [1:05:13] | How go the war stories? | 战争故事说得怎么样 |
| [1:05:16] | I never know exactly what it is I’m selling. | 我根本不知道我是在兜售什么 |
| [1:05:20] | It’s not the work. | 不是我们的工作 |
| [1:05:22] | I’m really just selling somebody else’s ass up the ladder. | 我只是在为别人加官进爵做嫁衣 |
| [1:05:25] | Still, it’s a hell of a lot better than… | 不过这还是要比…强多了 |
| [1:05:30] | Sorry. | 抱歉 |
| [1:05:32] | I got some things going on at home. | 我家里出了点事 |
| [1:05:36] | You okay? | 你还好吗 |
| [1:05:41] | Brian was playing with some older boys and a toddler. | 布莱恩之前在跟几个大男孩和一个幼童玩耍 |
| [1:05:46] | Things got out of hand… | 场面失控了 |
| [1:05:49] | and the older boys ended up suffocating the toddler. | 那几个大男孩把幼童给闷死了 |
| [1:05:53] | Oh, my God. | 我的天啊 |
| [1:05:55] | Brian saw it all. | 布莱恩目睹了全程 |
| [1:05:59] | He must’ve remembered the Bible story | 他肯定是记得《圣经》里的故事 |
| [1:06:01] | because he convinced the other boys | 因为他说服了那几个孩子 |
| [1:06:03] | to take the body and tie it to a cross. | 把尸体绑到了十字架上 |
| [1:06:08] | He’s exempt from charges, thankfully. | 幸好他没受到指控 |
| [1:06:11] | But he… | 但他… |
| [1:06:13] | We have to go through court-mandated protocols. | 我们得走完法院强制下达的程序 |
| [1:06:17] | Is Brian talking to someone? | 有人跟布莱恩交流吗 |
| [1:06:18] | We’ve got a psychiatrist, a social worker, | 现在有个精神病医生和一个社工 |
| [1:06:21] | benchmarks we have to meet. | 还需要达到很多要求 |
| [1:06:23] | How is Nancy? | 南茜还好吗 |
| [1:06:25] | She’s not grasping that Brian might need some kind of help. | 她不理解布莱恩可能需要一些帮助 |
| [1:06:29] | On the other hand, | 另一方面 |
| [1:06:30] | she won’t leave him alone for five minutes. | 她也老是守在孩子身边不愿走开 |
| [1:06:32] | That’s really why she’s not here tonight. | 所以她今晚才没来 |
| [1:06:34] | We haven’t left the house since it happened. | 出事之后我们就没离开过屋子 |
| [1:06:37] | I mean, just give it time. I mean, this is huge. | 耐心一点吧 这不是件小事 |
| [1:06:41] | And really, Bill, anything that I can do. | 还有 比尔 有什么要帮忙的一定找我 |
| [1:06:44] | I’m gonna ask for your discretion. | 我要请你保密 |
| [1:06:49] | Holden doesn’t know. | 霍顿不知道 |
| [1:06:53] | I understand. | 我能理解 |
| [1:06:59] | They look critically bored. | 他们好像无聊透了 |
| [1:07:01] | We should get back in there. | 我们还是进去吧 |
| [1:07:03] | Perform life support. | 再不救场就来不及了 |
| [1:07:11] | You know, Bill, I think that I just might sneak out. | 比尔 我还是偷偷先走好了 |
| [1:07:13] | I don’t blame you. | 我不怪你 |
| [1:07:18] | Wendy. | 温迪 |
| [1:07:20] | I hope I didn’t frighten you off. | 希望我没吓着你 |
| [1:07:21] | I’d love for us to finish our talk, maybe somewhere quieter. | 我很想继续跟你聊天 要不找个安静点的地方 |
| [1:07:24] | thank you, but I’m actually not feeling very well. | 谢谢 但是我有点不太舒服 |
| [1:07:27] | I’d love to drive you home. | 我可以送你回家 |
| [1:07:29] | – I insist. – I’m perfectly fine to drive. | -我坚持 -我自己开车没问题 |
| [1:07:32] | Well, at least let me see you out. | 那至少让我送你出门吧 |
| [1:07:33] | No, Warren, I’m going to see myself out. | 不用了 沃伦 我自己出去就好 |
| [1:07:36] | I insist. | 我坚持 |
| [1:07:45] | Wyman’s invited you to speak at the annual directors’ retreat. | 怀曼刚邀请你在年度局长级度假上发言 |
| [1:07:48] | I accepted for you. | 我替你接受了 |
| [1:07:51] | A spectacular country club: | 在一个特别好的乡村俱乐部 |
| [1:07:53] | skeet, golf. | 可以打双向飞碟 高尔夫 |
| [1:07:55] | No wives. | 不带妻子 |
| [1:07:57] | And it’s face time with the director. | 而且还能跟局长面对面交流 |
| [1:07:59] | That’s what we were hoping for tonight, sir? | 这是今晚聚会的目的吗 长官 |
| [1:08:04] | Miss. Let’s get this man a drink. | 小姐 给他一杯酒 |
| [1:08:06] | He’s earned it. | 他应得的 |
| [1:08:13] | Think you can get Holden to loosen up a little? | 你能让霍顿放松一点吗 |
| [1:08:16] | Events in a suspect’s life. | 嫌犯生活里发生的大事 |
| [1:08:17] | We’ve found a high incidence | 我们发现大多都来自 |
| [1:08:19] | of broken homes and neglected families… | 破碎的家庭 被家人忽视 |
| [1:08:20] | Did my partner tell you about Richard Speck? | 我搭档刚才有没有提到理查德・斯派克 |
| [1:08:22] | No. | 没有 |
| [1:08:23] | So Speck comes in, | 斯派克走进来 |
| [1:08:25] | and we see he’s got something in his hands. | 我们发现他手里捧了个东西 |
| [1:08:52] | – Hello? – Hey, Holden. | -喂 -霍顿 |
| [1:08:54] | News from Atlanta. | 亚特兰大刚来消息 |
| [1:08:55] | Jim. Tell me. | 吉姆 说吧 |
| [1:08:56] | Another body, another strangulation. | 又发现一具尸体 又是被勒毙 |
| [1:08:59] | How old? | 多大 |
| [1:09:00] | Twelve. | 12岁 |
| [1:09:01] | Clifford Jones. | 克里福德・琼斯 |
| [1:09:02] | He was collecting cans for change so his aunt could do laundry. | 他当时在捡罐子换零钱给他姨妈付洗衣费 |
| [1:09:05] | Broad daylight. | 光天化日下 |
| [1:09:07] | He’s number 13. | 他是第十三起了 |
| [1:09:11] | 每晚你沉睡时 我都在毁灭世界 查尔斯・曼森 |